Types of blades in Type 3 gunto mounts.

[george trotter]

Hi all,

I've been busy playing with my newly acquired Nakata Kanehide gendaito, mounted in Type 3 mounts (some mistakenly call this SNLF and/or late '44 pattern). These mounts were introduced in 1943.

As I now have 3 gendaito in Type 3 mounts (from standard metal saya type, to lacquered saya/ito type and special order), I have developed an interest in the varying changes in quality, fittings and bindings of Type 3 mounts.

Previously, I had asked whether anyone had ever see a mon on the Type 3 mounts (and the response seems to be NO), but this time I would like to ask...has anyone ever seen a pre-Showa period blade in Type 3 mounts?

 

In 40 years of collecting I have seen a fair number of koto, shinto, shinshinto, Meiji and Taisho blades in army kyugunto, Type 34, Type 38 mounts and also in navy Type Tachi (1937) mounts....but never in army Type 3, just Showa period oil-tempered blades at the lower end, and Showa period gendaito at the upper end....I just wondered if anyone has seen anything older than Showa?

Regards,

[Daniel]

Hi George, If I remember correctly I saw one on ebay about a year ago. I think it was a tired Koto or Shinto blade mounted in Type 3 Guntokoshirae with the exception of the tsuba wich were of a civilian type. I didn't look too close because of the condition so don't know if it was a put together piece or not.

Regards

Daniel

[Kai-Gunto]

The one on ebay was a put together Imo.

I had once a type 3 with a Mitsuoki gendaito with killer hamon dated 1942.

It had a plain sarute mounted , 100% sure it had been there from the start.

1 extra seppa with rim ,closeing over the kuchigane. Brown lacquered tsuka with real same and 2 iron screws ( mekugi). Wood scabbard with lacquered skin ,water proof.

 

Never seen on with mon.

[Brian]

Nope..never seen a mon or an earlier blade.

I am sure you are onto something here George.

 

Brian

[george trotter]

Hmmm...it is strange is it not? No mon, and no pre-Showa blades in Type 3.

I know this is a small survey, but I would think that in this knowledgeable group of advanced collectors somebody would have reported one by now if it existed....so, it seems these don't exist.

 

I am pretty sure Type 98 gunto continued to be fitted with pre-Showa blades and family mon well past 1943 when the Type 3 was introduced....a mystery why Type 3 were not personalised as well.

 

I look forward to one or both of these things being reported here first.

Regards,

[mdiddy]

I am pretty sure Type 98 gunto continued to be fitted with pre-Showa blades and family mon well past 1943

 

Would anyone know how long Type 98 gunto were continued to be fitted after the introduction of the Type 3? Any research in this space? I have heard that officers continued to prefer the Type 98 mounts after the Type 3 was introduced but have seen no conclusive evidence on the subject. I have also seen an abundance of 1943-dated Showato in Type 98 mounts, a handful (maybe) of 1944-dated Showato in Type 98 mounts, and no 1945-dated Showato in type 98 mounts.

 

I am curious as I have recently had an early Nagamitsu that was in Type 98 gunto mounts. However, the mounts featured Kai Gunto fittings on the saya and black same on the tsuka. My hypothesis was that since the surface Naval fleet was mostly destroyed by late 1943 and the Type 3 was being introduced that surplus Naval parts may have made up for a scarcity of Type 98 parts as the Type 98 was phased out for the Type 3.

 

Anyone have any insight?

[george trotter]

On the point of Type 98 mounts continuing to be supplied after the introduction of Type 3 mounts in 1943, I can say that it is definite. I have a record of a Seki Kanehide blade dated 10/44 mounted in Type 98.

Regards,