KizuKazu Posted January 25, 2012 Report Posted January 25, 2012 Some turkey has convinced an elderly man that he has a Yukimori wakizashi worth $90,000. eBay: SMALL Japanese SWORD MADE BY YUKIMORI 1536/SMALL BLADE /W SHEIF Item Id: 120848322092 I've written to the guy, firstly asking politely how he came to expect that value. He replied that someone whose name he won't reveal had told him that was the value of the sword. How many times have I heard that. This poor old guy is about to loose his house and he's hanging on this absurd valuation as his saviour. I'm guessing that his advisor is referring to the son of Yukimitsu. We all know Hawley's rating system is merely a rough guide that is sometimes way off but I can't find any information on this Yukimori - other than he being the son of Yukimitsu. If this is THE Yukimitsu, as in student of Shintogo Kunimitsu/contemporary of Masamune, one would think his son a kaji of higher value but I can find no reference to support this. Then again, all my books are packed in boxes. If I'm wrong and this is a sword of much higher value, this is best-case-scenario for this poor old guy. How about it guys. Here is an old guy (80's I think he said) about to loose his house. The photos are distant and show nothing. There is also a tanto that accompanies the wakizashi. Who knows what that may be? If this Yukimori is the son of a kaji who worked alongside Masamune - IF - surely it would be a case of an other error in the Hawley rating system - YUK297 & YUK299(?) - 20 points. I know he'd be lucky to get $90k for a Masamune right now (? I have no idea) but just throwing this up there to either get some help to let this guy down in his expectations, or maybe I'm wrong and he's sitting on something that may not be worth $90k but maybe enough to get him out of trouble. Over to you guys: Simon Binks
Jean Posted January 25, 2012 Report Posted January 25, 2012 To All NMB Members, I have read Simon's excuse for not being able to get his books (still packed). I have heard this on the board hundred times, so : PLEASE, NMB MEMBERS, YOUR FIRST TARGET MUST BE TO UNPACK YOUR BOOKS; IF YOU ARE ABLE TO UNPACK YOUR LAPTOP YOU CAN DO THE SAME FOR YOUR BOOKS
KizuKazu Posted January 25, 2012 Author Report Posted January 25, 2012 Jean said: To All NMB Members, I have read Simon's excuse for not being able to get his books (still packed). I have heard this on the board hundred times, so : PLEASE, NMB MEMBERS, YOUR FIRST TARGET MUST BE TO UNPACK YOUR BOOKS; IF YOU ARE ABLE TO UNPACK YOUR LAPTOP YOU CAN DO THE SAME FOR YOUR BOOKS I don't need an excuse for my books and most of my belongings to be in storage and have no plans on getting them out in the foreseeable future for other reasons I don't need to explain to a Japanese sword forum. I'm just trying to help an old man who is about to loose his house. I have searched the Web extensively. I'm pretty sure that the simple answer is that the apple fell far from the tree in Yukimori's circumstance. It happens. Why is the most simple, well-meaning jesture met wth such hostility. Every time I come here it results in a hostile result. This posting couldn't have been more selfless yet still I have to justify myself. I'm sure everybody saw this sword. Who else cared to do something, let the guy down from his impossible expectations? Even if this Yukimori is more valued than Hawley rates him, there is no way this poor old guy is going to get 1/10th way to $90k. I just wanted 1/ Others to write to him as well so he has realistic exectations, as I don't expect him to just take my word for it or 2/Get as much as I could for him. I don't want anything out of this. I'm not bidding on the blade or trying to get a free kantei for my benefit. I'm just trying to help an old man about to loose his house. I don't need my books for that. Simon Binks
Mark Posted January 25, 2012 Report Posted January 25, 2012 where is he located? maybe someone lives in the area and could help.
KizuKazu Posted January 25, 2012 Author Report Posted January 25, 2012 Just to qualify, I have Hawley, Fujishiro and a couple of others. When I refer to my books, I am refering to a library, cartons upon cartons of books going back hundreds of years from my family collection to the thousands I have purchased, including an extensive collection on Japanese swords, cartons of those alone, mostly in Japanese. Likening this to a laptop is akin to associating a stereo to my recording studio > 2 tracks vs infinite. All this pales into insignficance compared to the purpose of the original post - to try to help an elderly man about to loose his home in this economic crisis whilst we sit in luxury with money to throw away on expendables like Japanese swords. Simon Binks.
Brian Posted January 25, 2012 Report Posted January 25, 2012 viewtopic.php?f=3&t=11957 The guy has already been told multiple times. The sword is maybe worth $600-800. How the heck does Shintogo Kunimitsu tie in with a date of 1536 and some smith called Yukimori?? The whole thing is absurd. He isn't going to save his house with this one...and at 94 years old...he's doing pretty good with eBay. From one of his other auctions: Quote THIS ENGINE WAS MY CAD.CONVERTABLE I HAD JUST HAD IT OVERHAULED SO BOUGHT IT BACK FROM INSURANCE CO.I HAVE $2500.00 IN NEW TIMMEN CHAIN & HEADS I ALSO BOUGHT IT BACK FROM INSURANCE CO.I WAS GOING TO PUT IT IN MY BOAT, THEY NEVER MADE MANUFOLD THAT BIG.ONE LIKE IT 8.2 LITER WAS PUT IN GMC MOTOR HOME, IT COULD REALY MAKE IT ROOL VICS AUTO SAYS A DROP OF DIESEL IN EACH SPARK PLUG HOLETHEN DURN IT OVER' He has a boat??? At 94???? Simon...get real, and stop the attitude with moderators. Brian
Eric H Posted January 25, 2012 Report Posted January 25, 2012 The „poor old guy“ frontierdog (319, green star), 94 year old WW2 Vet. seems to be very active on eBay regarding his age The truth will be far away from his explanations... (Q & A). All what is poor are the pictures...and the audacitiy to ask this horrendous amount. Dear Simon Binks, it is beyond my imagination why you ask for support. Eric Question & Answer Answered On Q: Sir, I think that is sword is worth more than 100k. You should be asking more than that. It could even be in the million dollar range. Good luck Jan-24-12 A: DEAR GOOD GIRL;AS YOU MAY KNOW IM A 94 YEAR OLD WW2 VET.I HAD DEFERED THE TAXES ON MY HOME OF 50 YEARS.RECENTLY THEY KICKED ME OFF THE PROGRAM ,AND SAID I OWED $215,000'00 HAD I HAVE BEEN ABLE TO BRING HOME A SWORD I HAD DONE IN THE EMPERORS ROYAL PURPLE I MIGHT HAVE GOTTEN THE MONEY YOU TALK OF,HOWEVER IWILL DO THE BEST I CAN WITH HAVE THANK YOU VERRY MUCH FRONTIERDOG Q: May I ask as a collector of 30+ years, where you got the idea that this sword was worth $89,000? I will be able to offer advise. I have been watching and not with no surprise tat you ave received no bids. Sincerely, Simon simn@simon-binks.com Jan-24-12 A: SIR; I HAD A Japanese COLLECTOR , TELL ME IT WAS WORTH OVER 100,000.00 I WILL NOT RELEASE HIS NAME. THE RITE GUY WIILL COME BY , UNTIL THEN IM 94 YEAR OLD WW2 VET TRYING TO SAVE MY HOUSE.THANKS FRONTIERDOG
Jean Posted January 25, 2012 Report Posted January 25, 2012 My Dear Simon, Your reaction to my inocuous post, which in fact was general and not directed to you - shows that you are too sensitive and for wrong reasons Stop acting as a kid, playing the victim and saying that each time you are posting you are encountering hostility. I have read your posts previously and never seen any hostile comments from any NMB members or I would have deleted them. You have not the simplest idea of what hostility can result in when I am hostile to someone, believe me :D But to be hostile to someone implies that you must know him and develop a feeling or I don't know you and not willing to develop any, taking into account your way of reacting - Full stop - Quote I'm sure everybody saw this sword Sorry, but I have not seen it so probably about half of our members. There are people who don't spent their time on e-bay Quote I don't want anything out of this. I'm not bidding on the blade or trying to get a free kantei for my benefit. Stop playing the victim, no one on this board has accused you of doing such things ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo Now, I (together with Brian and John) am going to watch this post and any other comments which are not focused on : Quote I just wanted 1/ Others to write to him as well so he has realistic exectations, as I don't expect him to just take my word for it or 2/Get as much as I could for him. shall be deleted. The obvious answer you have made to this poor guy, I hope, is: "Without any certificate issued by NTHK or NBTHK (explaning what are these societies) this sword won't sell higher than a few thousands at most." adding " Like in painting, no one shall invest such sum without a certicate of authenticity issued by a well established authority"
John A Stuart Posted January 25, 2012 Report Posted January 25, 2012 There are very few people I trust on e-Bay and if there is a story created to elicit sympathy even less so. This object has been pulled from auction and no longer pertinent. John
KizuKazu Posted January 26, 2012 Author Report Posted January 26, 2012 There's that, there's always that, then there's the fact that America is in the worst economic shape it's been in since the 20's right now. Or so I read. I'm in Australia and things are OK here but I'm not so quick to judge desperate last stand life-rafts at the moment. Nobody's being forced to do anything. Nobody's going to pay $9k for such a sword, let alone $90k. It would be interesting to have a look, were it not a waste of time as there is no way he's going to let them go for their true value. I saw a picture of the tanto on another site where he has them also and; it's a could be. They are both worth a look; were they in reasonable hands. The guy could be a 35 y/o car salesman for all I know but as I said (but has been deleted), I'd rather waste a hour to give a person the benefit of doubt than turn my back on someone in need. Despite all the BS, perhaps he is about to loose his house. That would get me thinking creatively; a lot more creatively void of deceipt admitedly but being creative has been my career. A lot of people have to think creatively for the first time at the moment. That must be scary if you've worked on a production line all your life. This was all just intended as bottom-line humanity. At the end of the day, he's going to have to come to terms with the fact that they just won't sell. If he wants to sell them, needs any money at all, he's going to have to come to terms with the their true value and a son/student of Yukimitsu does sound exciting, if it really is. The tanto is anybody's guess. I'm going to try to get over to the US on a sword hunt this year so I'm going to keep touch with this guy. Showing him humanity was genuine but it may just pay off in the end. I doubt it but there are swords I have chased for 20 years. Simon Binks
Brian Posted January 26, 2012 Report Posted January 26, 2012 Did you just make up this "son/student of Yukimitsu" thing completely out of thin air??? Where on earth did anything mentioned anywhere here, or in the auction lead to that theory? The guy himself claims it is from 1536...so where are you dragging this from? What a pointless exercise. Brian
KizuKazu Posted January 26, 2012 Author Report Posted January 26, 2012 Yukimori is listed in Hawley YUK297 and YUK299 as the son of Yukimitsu. Like most else, the eBay mystery man probably got the date wrong. I have followed many erroneous half-truths to successful finds whilst other collectors passed off incomplete information. This is what sword hunting is all about. Some are dead ends, most of mine have not been. I've rattled off some names before. I don't believe I mentioned the Masamune tanto I found? Yukimori was a Bizen kaji but there was much exchange between Bizen and Soshu at this time. It could be another Yukimitsu but generally, if Hawley states a name when there are many, it's usually THE name. Yukimitsu was a student of Shintogo Kunimitsu, which would make him a contemporary of Masamune but Fred Weissberg goes as far to say that Yukimitsu was the father of Masamune. I always understood Shintogo Kunimitsu to be the adopted father of Masamune. The eBay guy knows nothing. He got the name from somewhere along with those false expectations. I'm more interested in the tanto. It could be anything but I like the look of it. I pulled a genuine Miyoshi Nagamichi katana off eBay a year ago based on the grace of the blade, as there was no close-up of the work and no shot of the nakago. $600 I think it was, as nobody else would take a chance. People tend to underestimate a graceful sugata, whereas I believe it is the first thing to look for and possibly one of the most difficult of tasks for a kaji. I've only recently turned to eBay for swords. Occasionally something good comes along but I have to use a different set of senses than previously without sword in hand. It's working. I have a number of fine blades using similar selection criteria. So no, I made nothing up but nothing is certain until sword is in hand and back from Shinsa. NBTHK Shinsa. I'm staying in contact with this man and he is expressing his gratitude for what I tried to do, which was out of genuine concern and no interest in the sword at that stage. Now we'll see, as I'm getting curious, more about the tanto. Until then, it's only pointless to state a position on relevance one way or another. I've followed longer shots than this to very successful outcomes. Remaining positive helps but then I'd have to get into the Copenhagen Interpretation of Quantum Physics, which is not as OT as you may think.
Guido Posted January 26, 2012 Report Posted January 26, 2012 KizuKazu said: Yukimori is listed in Hawley YUK297 and YUK299 as the son of Yukimitsu.I thought your books are stilll packed ...? If you think people are hostile towards you, you can always register under another alias and false name as you did already a couple of times in the past. But your writing style and paranoia will give you away eventually, so maybe it's not really a brilliant idea. For a strange reason this image always comes to my mind whenever I read a post of yours:
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