Mon Identification?

[Sporkkaji]

I'm wondering if anyone here can shed some light on a silver sake cup that I picked up. I tried looking online and it's got what looks to be a hybrid of the standard Kiri mon and the Minimoto family mon but I haven't been able to find an exact match. The only other marks on it are two small Kanji characters and a little butterfly on the bottom which I assume are hallmarks and/or maker's marks. I Don't know the age or any other details about it. Thanks in advance.

[Bugyotsuji]

Well the two characters underneath read right to left and describe the material and purity.

純銀

 

 

Such marks were introduced sometime before WWII (needs checking for exact date) so you know it is not older than when the system was introduced. They read right to left before WWII and left-right post WWII, I have read. So your sake cup may be some time pre-WWII...

[Sporkkaji]

Thanks for the tip! However I entered the text into Google's translation system and it came up with "sterling silver" while Yahoo's service said it means "pure silver". Now I'm confused, is the silver content 92.5% or 99.9+% ?? Any guess as to the meaning of the main design?

[Eric H]

It is the Goshichi no Kiri mon

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Goshichi_no_kiri.svg

 

Eric

[Geraint]

Hi C Lewis.

 

The hallmarks were introduced during the Meiji period but apparently from 1928 a mark indicating content was required so I suppose your piece is pre 1928. I don't think your Google and Yahoo searches contradict each other, the mark is an indicator of "pure"silver in that it specifies a minimum silver content, usually .925. Sterling silver is an English hallmark ranking for at least .925 silver with other metals allowed to add hardness to the silver, Britannia silver has .950 silver and is more rarely used. The marks from 1928 seem to refer to .950 as the Japanese standard.

 

Hope this helps.

[Bugyotsuji]

I collected Kiseru pipes for a while and found I was attracted to solid silver ones. They used to be very expensive twenty or thirty years ago, so I could only look, but the price has come down of late. Some of them have no marking, but you can tell they have a high silver content. Others have stamps like your cup, either the single Kanji 銀 or the double 純銀 and I found myself valuing such Japanese 'hallmarks'. (There is another expression 金or銀無垢 Kin- or Gin-muku which also means pure, solid, no impurities.) My understanding is that 100% pure silver is too soft for practicality, but the Japanese followed their own system of alloys, in parallel and possibly conscious of the Sterling etc. silver marks in the West. Either way I feel confident that Jungin 純銀 is probably purer silver than .925 Sterling, and possibly purer than even .950 Britannia.

[ehk]

It reminds me of a Japanese medal I had in my collection once. The medal in my post is not the one I owned.

 

The order of the Rising Sun, 7th Class (Kyokujitsu-shō):

 

 

 

But but the medal is kiri mon.

[Bugyotsuji]

Go-san kiri Mon, (3-5-3) but that's a beautiful medal!

 

C.Lewis, yours has some Sasa leaves underneath. Sometimes the members of two families will get married and an artist will be commissioned to represent the two Mon intertwined, but such a Mon may be a one-off solely to commemorate the occasion. This new 'Mon' may never become a mainstream Mon in its own right. Just a guess, though.

[IanB]

Gents, you are missing the fact that it isn't a simple kirimon but has further gentian leaves hanging below. No idea what it represents but I suspect some Taisho or early Showa organisation.

Ian B.

[Eric H]

Gents, you are missing the fact that it isn't a simple kirimon but has further gentian leaves hanging below.

Of course I have noticed the modification.

 

I add pictures of a cup I have bought some years ago to make a present to my daughter.

 

These cups were used for:

 

http://inventorspot.com/articles/japans ... cups_24672

 

Eric

[Baka Gaijin]

Evening all,

 

It looks closer to Go Shichi Onikiri (Which is not quite there, but closer)

 

Row two second from left:

 

http://www.tozandoshop.com/v/vspfiles/kamon/plant6.html

 

Or on second thoughts is it a "marriage piece" as in British Heraldry where two heraldic devices (Crests) were sometimes combined?

 

A combination of Goshichi Kiri and Gomai Sasa

 

Row two first from left

 

http://www.tozandoshop.com/v/vspfiles/kamon/plant6.html

 

and Row one second from left

 

http://www.tozandoshop.com/v/vspfiles/k ... ant12.html

 

Cheers