Five character mei and hamon - Who is this smith?

[NihontoEurope]

Howdy,

 

Can anyone help me translate this mei?

 

I am totally out of options (YOSHI-SADA, -MORI, -MUNE, -HIRA or -SUYE)

( :

 

Adding the hamon if that might help.

 

Regards

 

Martin

[Bugyotsuji]

豊後住吉幸

Bungo Ju Yoshiyuki

[NihontoEurope]

Piers,

 

Thanks. I had it all but the Yuki bit.

 

Do you know anything about him?

 

 

/Martin

[Bugyotsuji]

No, not at all. Just what I can see in books. There are a couple of Shinshinto smiths with that name. There are also 吉行 smiths from Bungo, one koto and one shinto. But nothing I can see fits exactly.

 

PS That last character is not quite right, for whatever reason. It falls in my mind between these two: 幸　峯

[NihontoEurope]

Piers,

 

I will try to look for smiths listed as 吉行. It could be that the litterature and the spelling on the web refers to a modern variant of "幸". Perhaps when looking at a 吉行 listed oshigata the actual mei spells 吉幸 on the nagako.

 

I refer to the "Hiro" character which is commonly typed as "広" in book and references, whereas "廣" on the nagako. I personally think it is wrong to type it in that way in references. There are other characters that are handled in the same way.

 

It is probably the "幸" kanji we have on the nagako. But you never know...

 

Thank you all for looking.

 

/Martin

[cabowen]

you are mixing apples and oranges here...

 

These two kanji, both pronounced yuki, 行　幸, are not variants of the same kanji but different kanji. Many kanji were simplified after the war and thus there are old and newer styles of writing. Hiro is one such kanji: 広　廣 are the same kanji, the first the modern way to write the hiro on the right....

[Bugyotsuji]

Chris is right.

 

There is however an example I saw earlier today of a smith who signed 吉行　on his early works, and 吉幸　subsequently.

[cabowen]

Chris is right.

 

There is however an example I saw earlier today of a smith who signed 吉行　on his early works, and 吉幸　subsequently.

 

That does happen, rarely, without a doubt. I just wanted to make sure the distinction was made....

[Bugyotsuji]

Martin sent a pm wanting to know which one, so here goes.

 

There was a Keio Shinshinto smith named 吉幸 from Houki (around Mt Daisen, Izumo) whose original name was 吉行, according to the Token Yoran, p.131

 

I think if a Mei rings little bells in various different directions, (especially with a big name out there) and you keep searching hopefully, but nothing seems to quite fit, it is often an indication of Gimei, for whatever reason.

[NihontoEurope]

Piers,

 

Thank you for the information. I have searched and searched and have found no information. Unfortunately the mei rings no bell at all for me.

 

/Martin

[runagmc]

Do any of the smiths from Bungo with yoshi as the first part of thier name use this kanji 吉?

I did a quick computer search and can only find it written these ways 賢,義, 能,良 ...

[Bugyotsuji]

I seem to remember finding two, Adam; I'll check the books when I get home.

[John A Stuart]

A few. Different times and second kanji for you to check. Hawleys Yoshi, hiro 105 106, kane 231 234, kiyo 252 260, masa 310 353, mori 498 499 500 501, moto 523, nobu 647, sada 703 704 723 724 725, sane 771, shige 782 783, tada 827, tsugu 898 899, yasu 1019, yuki 1031 1032 1033 1034. John

[NihontoEurope]

A few. Different times and second kanji for you to check. Hawleys Yoshi, hiro 105 106, kane 231 234, kiyo 252 260, masa 310 353, mori 498 499 500 501, moto 523, nobu 647, sada 703 704 723 724 725, sane 771, shige 782 783, tada 827, tsugu 898 899, yasu 1019, yuki 1031 1032 1033 1034. John

 

John,

 

I will check later on today. I also found an "AKI" character that might have the same-ish strokes as the "YUKI".

 

/Martin

[Bugyotsuji]

Pics as requested.

 

Here is an example of Yoshiyuki if 吉幸 if that is indeed the right kanji. (Token Yoran p.131)

 

The pics after that show examples of 吉幸 and then 吉行 Yoshiyuki from 'Bungo' or 'Bushu' (Nihonto Meikan pp 1176 & 1177).

[Jacques]

Hi,

 

Martin sent a pm wanting to know which one, so here goes.

 

There was a Keio Shinshinto smith named 吉幸 from Houki (around Mt Daisen, Izumo) whose original name was 吉行, according to the Token Yoran, p.131

Toko taikan (page 757) and Iimura Shinshinto taikan (page 668) say same thing.

[NihontoEurope]

Hi all,

 

Found this at NihontoClub:

 

I checked my Fujishiro at an earlier stage, but there is no match. I do not know the probability, but he could have changed his name as he was moving to another region/school.

 

The search is continued : )

 

/Martin

[runagmc]

Thanks Piers,

[NihontoEurope]

One year later...

 

I have done some more study on the signature.

 

Two options:

 

1. YOSHIYUKI

 

2. YOSHISHIGE

 

Does anyone have any info/oshigata of YOSHISHIGE?

 

豊後國高田住藤原吉重

豊後住吉重

 

[attachment=0]IMG_6290.JPG[/attachment]

 

/Martin

[Markus]

I think I have pretty the same info on Yoshiyuki (吉幸) in my Index (see preview PDF) BTW.

 

What book is the scan from? It says the old entry mentions Keichô but gives also the

information "maybe Genroku". I listed this Bungo Yoshishige according to the entry in

the "Arami-mei-zukushi" which says Keicho and which is referred to your scan too.

 

Yoshishige (吉重), Keichō (慶長, 1596-1615), Bungo – „Bungo no Kuni Takada-jū Fujiwara Yoshishige“ (豊後国高田住藤原吉重)

 

Yoshiyuki.pdf

[NihontoEurope]

Markus,

 

The scan is from my book "Sword of Oita Prefecture part 1 - 大分県の刀", One of the BungoTo bibles.

 

I have been doing some research going back and forth considering YUKI or SHIGE and now I lean towards SHIGE.

 

What I did find was that some SHIGE characters have been chiselled in by smiths like "mine" with a prolonged vertical stroke through the body below, whereas on most YUKI they seem not to be straight at the \_/-part (幸) when the SHIGE normally is |_|(重).

 

Regarding Jidai; it fits 1600-1700 era and it is difficult to say where it should be. Perhaps a better fit in the Genroku.

Keichō (慶長, 1596-1615)

Genroku (元禄, 1688-1704)

 

[attachment=0]IMG_6295_.JPG[/attachment]

 

Thank you for looking.

 

/Martin

[cabowen]

I think you are correct with shige....