joseph1 Posted August 24, 2011 Report Posted August 24, 2011 Dear Sir's I,m looking for information about this smith. "Bishu Ju Kuni Yasu". Please correct my translation if incorrect.I wasn't sure of the first Kanji.The blade is a Katana in gunto mounts,has no arsenal stamp,has Ubu Ha,and is water tempered.Any information you can give me would be most appreciated. Best Regards: Joseph1 Quote
cabowen Posted August 24, 2011 Report Posted August 24, 2011 Oshu, not Bishu 尾州 This smith worked in Aichi Prefecture. Not much is known of him.... EDIT: Bishu is correct..... Quote
Surfson Posted August 24, 2011 Report Posted August 24, 2011 Looks like a nice gunto in an excellent state of preservation. Clearly hand made by a smith with some skill. A nice sword to enjoy. Quote
Nobody Posted August 25, 2011 Report Posted August 25, 2011 Oshu, not Bishu 尾州.......... Ah, also 尾州 usually reads Bishu. Ref. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Owari_Province Quote
cabowen Posted August 25, 2011 Report Posted August 25, 2011 Sorry about that, of course Bishu is correct..... Quote
Nobody Posted August 25, 2011 Report Posted August 25, 2011 I know little about the smith. He appears in the following list as Mano Kuniyasu. Ref. http://home.earthlink.net/~ttstein/tosho.htm Quote
joseph1 Posted August 25, 2011 Author Report Posted August 25, 2011 Thanks Chris and Mr Moriyama for your responses,and all for your replies.Am I correct in thinking that the swordsmith worked around 1941?Thanks much also for the links supplied by Mr Moriyama,as they have a wealth of information. Best Regards to all: Joseph1 Quote
cabowen Posted August 25, 2011 Report Posted August 25, 2011 Yes, he worked during WWII in Aichi prefecture. Quote
joseph1 Posted August 25, 2011 Author Report Posted August 25, 2011 Thankyou Chris,and Best regards: Joseph1 Quote
chrisf Posted August 31, 2011 Report Posted August 31, 2011 Also working in Aichi and with same family name MANO MASAYASU whose swords bear a number of similarities,style of mei,yasurimei and hamon and I think I read somewhere (could be wrong) that it was thought that there were two generations. Also on many Masayasu nakago there is a small stamp like a small crescent moon,maybe to indicate daimei or shoshinmei? I have owned a couple of swords by Masayasu and handled two or three more and all looked to be well forged and had hamon based on suguha but with lots of activities like nijuba and uchinoke (all clearly visible in the 2nd I owned which was in almost mint original polish). Hope this helps a bit. Quote
joseph1 Posted September 1, 2011 Author Report Posted September 1, 2011 Thankyou Chrisf I looked again at the nakago with magnifiers,and could not find any other stamps.Just some painted numbers on the end of the nakago.The Hamon,from the middle of the sword to the kissaki is a pretty regular ko-gunome,with assorted activity,but from the hamachi to the middle is sort of all mixed up,with lots of activity and Nie.(see picture below.There is what appears as a whirlpool which I dont know the name for.Any help would be appreciated!Cant seem to get a good picture of the monouchi area.I need a coarse in how to photograph!Again,thanks for the comments.Oh,does anyone know if a sword like this could be papered? Best Regards: joseph1 Quote
cabowen Posted September 1, 2011 Report Posted September 1, 2011 It should paper at the NBTHK and NTHK-NPO without a problem. Quote
joseph1 Posted September 2, 2011 Author Report Posted September 2, 2011 Thankyou Chris Just what qualifies any sword to be papered? Does the smith who made it have to be dead?If a sword is Gimei,will the sword be disqualified?As I know nothing about the process of papering a sword (or the relevance) where can I go to find this information? Thanks again,and best regards: joseph1 Quote
cabowen Posted September 2, 2011 Report Posted September 2, 2011 It must be a nihon-to, It must be of a certain quality, in good condition (not polished too much), without serious flaws like hagire, if signed, genuine signature. If a modern smith, usual requirement is that he is deceased for a while but I have seen exceptions made to that.... Quote
chrisf Posted September 3, 2011 Report Posted September 3, 2011 Chris,do you think it worthwhile to have a sword like the one under discussion papered?Will the owner know any more about his sword than he does now and what 'added value' do papers give in your opinion? From my own perspective if I was offered this and told it was papered I'd say 'So what?',I can see exactly what it is without having to have a piece of paper to tell me and that applies to a lot of swords that I see in the commercial marketplace which are not exceptional,not particularly rare but are made to seem more important because they have a paper. No disrespect is intended here towards those organisations that provide shinsa teams whose depth of knowledge and wealth of experience is way beyond anything I might aspire to but quite honestly unless the sword is exceptional I just don't see the point. Quote
Bruno Posted September 3, 2011 Report Posted September 3, 2011 Why a smith has to be dead to have one of his blade papered? It is a strange condition. I thought they were judging the quality of the blade only. Quote
Gunome Posted September 3, 2011 Report Posted September 3, 2011 Why a smith has to be dead to have one of his blade papered? It is a strange condition. When smith is alive he could confirm himself his work Quote
cabowen Posted September 3, 2011 Report Posted September 3, 2011 No disrespect is intended here towards those organisations that provide shinsa teams whose depth of knowledge and wealth of experience is way beyond anything I might aspire to but quite honestly unless the sword is exceptional I just don't see the point. Kantei-sho are expert opinions on the quality AND authenticity of a mei. The majority of collectors like this validation /insurance, as it were, when laying out money for a blade. Peace of mind. The bigger the reputation of the smith, the more value they add. While you may not see any value in them for less than exceptional blades, it would undoubtedly help with a sale to someone looking for that peace of mind....Assuming the reputation of the shinsa team that issued the kantei sho was good.... Up until maybe 10 years ago, gimei gendaito were unheard of....since they have become more popular and more expensive, with the collapse of the market for shinsakuto, fakes have started to crawl out from all over. Therefore, while I would never have recommended shinsa for gendaito 10 years ago, I would for the bigger names now, though again, one needs to choose the shinsa team wisely as not all of them are up to speed on WWII era smiths. The blade under discussion here is not a candidate for fakery. A kantei sho would validate the workmanship as of good quality which would make those unable to decide that on their own sleep easier I suppose. Quote
chrisf Posted September 3, 2011 Report Posted September 3, 2011 Thanks Chris,as always interesting points to take on board and the appearance of gimei gendaito is worth bearing in mind given the prices that top smiths are realising. I'm interested to hear about the struggles of shinsakuto,is this because of the downturn in the Japanese economy,the law on sword production or do you think that they became overpriced when the Japanese economy boomed and people invested huge amounts in 'art' and it was a sellers market? Quote
cabowen Posted September 3, 2011 Report Posted September 3, 2011 I'm interested to hear about the struggles of shinsakuto,is this because of the downturn in the Japanese economy,the law on sword production or do you think that they became overpriced when the Japanese economy boomed and people invested huge amounts in 'art' and it was a sellers market? I think it is all of the above, but without a doubt, like the real estate market, when the bubble popped in the early 1990's, everything that had been overinflated has been suffering ever since. The Japanese economy has been in limbo for near on 20 years and the last thing people buy when the economy is in the toilet is expensive toys.....Smiths at the peak of the bubble complained because the limit on their output put a cap on their income, now the number of smiths who can even sell 1 sword a month are very few and far between. I fear we are entering another dark era for the craft... Quote
sencho Posted September 4, 2011 Report Posted September 4, 2011 and the last thing people buy when the economy is in the toilet is expensive toys....... I beg to differ... maybe I am dealing with a whole different class of people, but business is booming with the strength of the yen... and how expensive the toy, is just relative... Cheers! Quote
cabowen Posted September 4, 2011 Report Posted September 4, 2011 I talk with craftsman and collectors in Japan on a regular basis and they all tell me the same thing- things are extremely slow....I am sure industries on the import side are doing well.... Quote
chrisf Posted September 4, 2011 Report Posted September 4, 2011 Thanks for that insight Chris,surely the Japanese government would take steps to protect and preserve the craft of the sword and associated arts,I have always admired the fact that they make an effort to safeguard their heritage,the concept of Ningen Kokuho (hope that's correct) is something that every country should embrace,we had superb craftsmen working in the gun trade in Birmingham and cutlers in Sheffield and I don't think there's much left of either now. Quote
cabowen Posted September 4, 2011 Report Posted September 4, 2011 One can only hope....one or two smiths is hardly enough though to keep the craft healthy... Quote
joseph1 Posted September 4, 2011 Author Report Posted September 4, 2011 Thanks all for you're comments and discussion.I would like to get the blade papered someday,but for now,a new handlewrap and tsuka is in order! Best Regards: Joseph1 Quote
David Flynn Posted September 5, 2011 Report Posted September 5, 2011 In a competitive market, maybe the Japanese craftsman should lower their prices? Quote
cabowen Posted September 5, 2011 Report Posted September 5, 2011 In a competitive market, maybe the Japanese craftsman should lower their prices? Many I know have. Besides a Japanese economy that has been in a virtual recession for nearly 15 of the last 20 years, the issue is a yen that is up nearly 40% in the last few years.... Maybe if more in the West supported the professional craftsman instead of self trained polishers..... Quote
chrisf Posted September 5, 2011 Report Posted September 5, 2011 Chris,when you have a society that values Wayne Rooney more highly than a nurse or teacher then you know you're in trouble. Quote
chrisf Posted September 6, 2011 Report Posted September 6, 2011 The point I intended to make using Rooney as a reference was that values and perspectives have changed so much that it's no surprise than highly skilled artisans who have dedicated a lifetime to their crafts are struggling. For those who don't know him,Wayne Rooney plays football for Manchester United and is an arrogant,foul mouthed,ignorant lout.In October last year he negotiated a new pay deal reckoned to be £250,000 PER WEEK How many swords would Kenji Mishina have to polish to earn that? Even more to the point how long would a nurse or teacher have to work for that amount? Sorry if it seems 'off topic' but it seems that fewer people are interested in appreciating culture,art and history andare satisfied with MacD,Sky sports and tv soaps. Quote
cabowen Posted September 7, 2011 Report Posted September 7, 2011 yes, the value of skilled craftsman and artists is little appreciated in the main these days..... Quote
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