Any ideas on this rusty old blade?

[max_levy]

Hi everyone,

I purchased (very cheaply as a lucky dip rather than an educated purchase) This katana blade in lacquer saya from an auction on the other side of the country to me. Sadly these were the only images they could provide me, combined with my limited knowledge is a bit of a disaster. I appreciate the photo's don't divulge much and its a poor condition mumei blade, but I wondered if any of you guys with more knowledge than me could shed your opinions this way i.e. age etc? As soon as it's in my possession I'll post some detailed images.

 

Many thanks in advance for your time.

Max

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks again

[drbvac]

IMHO :: Well, the nakago is an interesting patina and fairly long and the blade itself must be well over 26-27 inches. The shape and coloration would make me think late edo as it does not have much curvature and what I can see of the hamon - you may have done OK - could do with a polish and depending on what others say - could be worth doing so - but - WDIK

[max_levy]

Thanks for the post! far more encouraging than I anticipated! :D I was half expecting people to tell me to stop wasting my money lol

[nagamaki - Franco]

recognizing the limits of images and the distinct possiblity of being incorrect, hope so, I would still strongly suspect this hamon is drawn in, you'll need to determine this for yourself.

[Grey Doffin]

The hamon in picture 2 is drawn in. Doesn't mean there isn't a real hamon but does raise a flag. Grey

[drbvac]

No doubt in 2 but the pic of the whole blade holds at least some promise - hamon aside ?"

[Ted Tenold]

Based on what is visable in the images, it reminds me of Geishu Masamitsu work. Shinshinto maker from the Owari Motonaga school.

[cabowen]

Based on what is visable in the images, it reminds me of Geishu Masamitsu work. Shinshinto maker from the Owari Motonaga school.

 

I had a blade by Masamitsu and it was nothing like this sword, though maybe your experience has been different....This looks more like Mino or a derivative like Echizen, Owari, etc. to me.....

[Ted Tenold]

Chris,

 

I remember seeing yours and noting the difference in work style. This is the one I had;

 

http://www.legacyswords.com/fs_ant_daito2.htm

 

It was mumei with NBTHK Hozon Kanteisho.

[max_levy]

I'm glad this is stirring lots of interest and debate! I cant wait to get some better shots for you all!

[Peter Bleed]

This has been a surprisingly interesting discussion. Thank you all. My first impression was that this was a nice looking nakago - - and an ugly blade. I guessed a bad gendai with suspicious tang. Ted convinced me it might be older than I thought.

The forum is certainly working. Thank you all.

But even polished, I say this is an ugly sword!

Peter

[cabowen]

Chris,

 

I remember seeing yours and noting the difference in work style. This is the one I had;

 

http://www.legacyswords.com/fs_ant_daito2.htm

 

It was mumei with NBTHK Hozon Kanteisho.

 

Definitely similar though being mumei, and having seen a few Masamitsu blades, I am not sure if I would bet the ranch on it being Masamitsu....

[max_levy]

The hamon in picture 2 is drawn in. Doesn't mean there isn't a real hamon but does raise a flag. Grey

 

Thanks for all the input everyone. I'm looking forward to taking a closer look in the flesh. Im aware the hamon looks rather odd, how exactly are hamons 'drawn in'? I'm aware of acid etching and wire brushing etc to me it almost looks like the hamon on this blade is more glossy than the rest of the blade, maybe just the light? What process in your opinion has it been faked with?

Thanks for any tips!

 

Max

[reinhard]

Max, I don't think the hamon was "drawn in". The blade was mistreated by an amateur and left at an early stage of the polishing process. During polishing the hard Ha is shining darker than the softer Jigane, for the polishing stones leave smaller marks on the hard steel of the edge than on the softer rest of the body. This effect is reversed by kesho-technique, i.e. using thin wafers of uchigumori stones in a particular way during the final stage of polishing, thus masking the naturally darker Ha. Added pic shows the four final stages of polishing (top to bottom) done by a craftsman.

In order to find out if there is a real hamon or not, you need to hold the blade pointing towards a single light bulb. Then look at the Ha from a shallow angle. There should be a milky, white line between the hardened edge and the rest of the blade.

 

reinhard

[max_levy]

That's really interesting! And explains it perfectly with the pics! I'll take a look when it comes! Thanks again

[Ford Hallam]

I like the sofa. :D and the tiger skin cushion.

[Klop]

I agree with Reinhard on the hamon, to me it also seems like a check to see what's there. It's also visible in the kissaki.

 

About the nakago, anyone else who sees a plugged mekugi-ana halfway (+ new one, and thus machi moved up a bit) or is it my imagination?

 

Greetings,

Eric K.

[drbvac]

"Well it is either a plugged mekugi-ana about 2" closer to the end of the nakago or a very odd bit of dust in a circle , the blade certainly looks shortened and maybe if original length it wouldn't be so straight if it was koshi-sori before. The curvature would have been closer to the hamachi IMHO but why would one plug an unused mekugiana? Are they not just left alone.

[John A Stuart]

Hi Dr., It is found quite often with copper usually. I prefer them plugged. It may be done to forestall corrosion in that place creating a weak spot, but, I haven't seen an unplugged one cause problems, just a thought. John

[max_levy]

Hopefully I'll be able to confirm in a week or so after a closer look! Will get some detailed images and dimensions!

[kuromido]

Can anyone please elaborate on the term "drawn in"

Are we talking about an acid etched hamon or are there other ways to forge/ fake a hamon excluding the really obvious

ones like media blast and stoned in?

 

Thanks

PeterD