gtstcactus Posted February 9, 2011 Report Posted February 9, 2011 Hey, Just thought I'd pop a couple of pics of the Tsuba from the wakazashi I've just aquired... The seller said the Tsuba was possibly older than the sword (which he said is 17th century but thats unconfirmed). Any info appreciated... The dimensions are 5.8cm top to bottom, 5.7cm width, 0.4cm thick. Quote
gtstcactus Posted February 9, 2011 Author Report Posted February 9, 2011 and a side on view.... Quote
gtstcactus Posted February 9, 2011 Author Report Posted February 9, 2011 cast copy to me. Perhaps you could help me (and perhaps others) learn and explain the tell tale signs you see, that lead you to the said conclusion.... Quote
Henry Wilson Posted February 9, 2011 Report Posted February 9, 2011 It looks like a late Edo period Owari sukashi tsuba. I am not so sure it is cast but the condition is not very good. The overall design looks very stiff and not natural.... Quote
Marius Posted February 9, 2011 Report Posted February 9, 2011 Perhaps you could help me (and perhaps others) learn and explain the tell tale signs you see, that lead you to the said conclusion.... Well, you might want to read this: http://www.ksky.ne.jp/~sumie99/tsubacastiron.html - I find the remarks there quite good. Also, please note that the tsuba has a crack. It woud be very unlikely for a forged tsuba to have a crack in such a thick rim. Besides, really bad cast copies (I am not talking about modern cast fakes) are like pornography - hard to define, but you know what it is when you look at it Seriously - look for remains of the casting seam inside the openings. Quote
Lorenzo Posted February 9, 2011 Report Posted February 9, 2011 the tell tale signs you see, that lead you to the said conclusion.... The crack is one factor, but the very evident proof is the sekigane that instead of being a copper piece is integral with the tsuba body. Look here, at yours: And then look at this (stolen on internet..) Quote
gtstcactus Posted February 9, 2011 Author Report Posted February 9, 2011 Well, you might want to read this: http://www.ksky.ne.jp/~sumie99/tsubacastiron.html - I find the remarks there quite good. Also, please note that the tsuba has a crack. It woud be very unlikely for a forged tsuba to have a crack in such a thick rim. Besides, really bad cast copies (I am not talking about modern cast fakes) are like pornography - hard to define, but you know what it is when you look at it Seriously - look for remains of the casting seam inside the openings. Thanks for the link. Ok I have just inspected the openings and then gone back over it with my 30x lens, I can't see any remains of a casting seam.... perhaps they were filed off. Could a forged tsuba be damaged like that from a sword strike? Quote
gtstcactus Posted February 9, 2011 Author Report Posted February 9, 2011 The crack is one factor, but the very evident proof is the sekigane that instead of being a copper piece is integral with the tsuba body. Look here, at yours: [attachment=0]waki8.jpg[/attachment] And then look at this (stolen on internet..) [attachment=1]sukashishakudo2.jpg[/attachment] Lorenzo, thank you for your explanation, it may be elementary to some of you more experienced folk around here.... but to me it's big learning curve! When it was made would it not have had a smooth surface and the bit you've pointed out would have been covered and unseen? Could some other metal have been used and lost over time? Quote
Lorenzo Posted February 9, 2011 Report Posted February 9, 2011 Could a forged tsuba be damaged like that from a sword strike? It is unlikely to me. Lorenzo, thank you for your explanation, it may be elementary to some of you more experienced folk around here .... but to me it's big learning curve! You are welcome. Sorry for having detailed before, my fault Regards Quote
Martin Posted February 9, 2011 Report Posted February 9, 2011 Hi Jason, maybe you should try to clean the rusted parts to be sure what material the "Sekigane" are made of. You could try to clean it with an old toothbrush and a little soap or with a cloth soaked with alcohol. This should then reveal if the "Sekigane" are copper ones. If they indeed turn out to be of the same metal as the Tsuba, I would also say it is a cast piece... Quote
Grey Doffin Posted February 9, 2011 Report Posted February 9, 2011 Hi Jason, Sekigane on a tsuba are put there to provide the proper fit to the blade's nakago. They are always made using soft metal (copper usually) so the tsuba doesn't wear away at the nakago. When a cast copy is made of a tsuba with copper sekigane, the copy is all iron. See if a magnet sticks as well to the sekigane as it does to the rest of the tsuba. If so, pretty certain you have a cast copy. Grey Quote
Soshin Posted February 10, 2011 Report Posted February 10, 2011 I would like to point out that the crack is I think a minor point as you see many forged iron tsuba with minor cracks that don't go complete through the sukashi and don't compromise the structure of the tsuba. This has been personally confirmed by me from a tsuba I purchased from Grey late last year which is been since to be confirmed to be a Owari Sukashi tsuba from the Momoyama or ealry Edo periods. The biggest thing that makes me this this wakazashi tsuba is a cast iron copy is the iron "sekigane" in the nakago ana. This is clear evidence that a cast mold was used to make this tsuba. Thanks for sharing and for the discussion. These type of discussions help people avoid purchasing fakes. Yours truly, David S. Quote
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