Kai-gunto

[MrJones]

Howdy lads and lasses. I know this will seem horribly vague, but... well, having a job and all, I've started getting things that interest me at long last. Among these is a jezail, which has consumed a fair wodge of my time and money for the last six months; another long-term goal is a Japanese sword.

 

Now, a week or so ago the catalogue for Thomas Del Mar's latest auction, down in London, came into my hands at work. While idly flicking through it at lunch, I suddenly stopped. Lot #7:

 

"A Japanese NAVAL SWORD (KATANA), 20TH CENTURY

with curved single-edged fullered blade, signed tang pierced with a single hole, iron tsuba, and iron mounts decorated with soft metal, in its saya

72.5cm; 28 1/2in blade

Estimate: 200-300"

http://www.thomasdelmar.com/Catalogues/ ... 0007-0.jpg

 

Sadly, after a lot of thinking I've realised that I just can't afford to part with that kind of money on the run up to Christmas. Indeed, I'm still recovering from all the gun-related things I've had to get to work on my musket. It has, however, got me thinking; for the past 12 months I've thought about a Japanese sword, but now the very real prospect of getting a Kai-gunto seems, at last, to be in sight, and to have a piece of the Imperial Navy's history in my own hands would certainly be a joy.

 

So, before I go launching money around at things, I'd like to know a little more about 'em. I've lurked here a while, as you know, and I've read that, among other things, most of them are stainless steel and machine-made (fair enough, they need to resist salt-water corrosion), and that they're rather rarer than the Army swords. Nonetheless, beyond that I know nothing much. What sort of market price do they command? Is this one more likely to be a gendaito or similar, being signed? Just how rare are they anyway? I know a stainless steel one probably isn't much of a cutter, but their historical value is surely quite high.

 

So yes. Sorry for being so vague, but I reckon I can only ask and hope for some help from you very helpful chaps. Thanks very much!

 

Meredydd Jones

 

(By the way - figure I might as well get over this adolescent terror of using one's name on the web. I'm not exactly likely to be lured to a terrible fate from the NMB... and anyone that tried would get one hell of a shock )

[mdiddy]

Hello,

 

The sword in the link to the auction is not a Kai Gunto. We would need better photos, but from a distance it kind of looks Chinese in origin.

 

While you search for a good sword I would recommend picking up a book for the time being. If you are interested in military swords, try Military Swords of Japan, 1868-1945 by Fuller and Gregory. It will have info that will help you identify Kai Gunto or Shin Gunto vs. potential fakes.

 

Matt

[MrJones]

Very interesting, there, Matt; I'm surprised if that is the case, since T. Del Mar's stuff is usually pretty good. That said, one must never discount the possibility that an earlier collector was led astray. I fully intend to pick up a copy of Military Swords of Japan (along with Kaigun, Sunburst, Heavy Cruiser Takao and a bunch of other IJN-related stuff) as soon as possible. Might arrange that as my next inter-library loan, actually.

[W K Clifford]

The sword in the link to the auction is not a Kai Gunto. We would need better photos, but from a distance it kind of looks Chinese in origin.

 

I concur. Definitely not kai gunto koshiare. Tsuka-maki is very dubious.

[Henry Stewart]

Sir,

 

If you want a rule of thumb to apply look at the saya. In the naval Kai Gunto it usually has two distinct seperate anchor points for attachement to the uniform belt,whereas the Shin Gunto Imperial Army version usually has only one.

I cannot see any on the impression submitted in fact it looks to my somewhat jaundiced eye a little "moth eaten" to say the least. You would need much better photographs of it for any further definite opinions to be put forward. Indeed Gregory and Fuller would offer you some valuable guidance. Good luck in your searches.

 

Henry.

[estcrh]

Here is a good link for you. http://home.earthlink.net/~steinrl/nihonto.htm

[Weidas]

its impossible to tell something about blade from this picture, but koshirae is definitely not kai gunto and looks like made in China. Mr. Jones, its not THAT hard to find on internet how kai gunto mounts supposed to look...

[MrJones]

Thank you one and all for the helpful information. Makes me rather glad I couldn't afford to spend good money, really. However, I should like it noted that, although I have at least some idea of how a Kai-gunto should be constructed, if I've learned anything thus far in life it's that my knowledge is so limited as to be non-existent. I'd far sooner be cautious and ask questions, before basing decisions on my own meagre knowledge, than go off at half-cock while basking in the glory of my own ill-founded confidence.

 

Perhaps I'm over-cautious, but with good reason, in short: I'm over-cautious because I remain very conscious of my ignorance and callowness in approaching this subject. Now I agree, that certainly looks very little like the standard description and image of a Kai-gunto. However, since I am ignorant - shamefully so - I refused to discount the possibility that it might be some strange variant thereof, or a rather beaten-about example, that I hadn't seen before.

 

Happily, my ignorance is being whittled away, bit by bit. Copy of Military Swords of Japan now en route, for a start!