Mounted on a Gunto by Sukenaga

[Lindus]

Not being a Tsuba man I never really loked at this untill around 20 years after aquiring,it is mounte on asword by Sukenaga and at the time although the sword was civil but with a combat cover.

Can any enlighten me as to age and school etc?.

 

Thanks

Roy

[cspage]

Cool, Roy. Could we see the other side, please? And maybe a shot that has the thickness showing with inside of sukashi, with dimensions listed? It's an intersting combination of themes. Thanks.

 

Colin

[Lindus]

  cspage said:

Cool, Roy. Could we see the other side, please? And maybe a shot that has the thickness showing with inside of sukashi, with dimensions listed? It's an intersting combination of themes. Thanks.

 

Colin

 

 

Hi Colin

Dimensions are.....

 

Thckness at seppa dia...4mm

" " Mimi....3mm

Size ...7.5cm

 

Each face is pretty much identical,see attached.

 

Thanks

Roy

[Soshin]

I like the tsuba. I would say that the tsuba is likely Bakumatsu Choshu. I interested in what other people think.

 

 

 

Yours truly,

David S. (Soshin)

[Lindus]

Thanks David

 

Yes it is nice,shame about the condition but really that is not so important as on the sword it shows well.

 

Regards

Roy

[Mike]

I have a tsuba with similar design, water wheel and cherry flower, it measures 68 mm X 69 mm X 3.7 mm (at the mimi).

I have seen identical to mine on NCJSC To-Ron few years ago, described as katsushi. I tend to think mine is shoami dated to mid-edo.

 

 

Mike

[Lindus]

Ha d call from an old Tsuba man, I quote....

 

"Half pierced Chrysanthemum,half Kamakura bori,Saotome & Bori work,Good."

 

Dont know, does that sound fair?.

Roy

[Soshin]

Roy,

 

The carving technique of the waves do look like Kamakura bori from the photos provided. How the flowers are done in negative silhouette and how the sukashi design when the tsuba is flipped are mirror images reminds me of Choshu as well as the seppa-dai and the hitsu ana shape. The overall size and shape of the tsuba makes me think late Edo (i.e. Bakumatsu) period. The mixture of techniques also makes me think late Edo. A good photo of the tsuba mimi or edge would be very helpful. Thank you for sharing photos of your nice tsuba.

 

 

 

Yours truly,

David S. (Soshin)

 

(08/12/10: Edited to fix a minor grammar error. )

[Lindus]

  Soshin said:

Roy,

 

The carving technique of the waves do look like Kamakura bori from the photos provided. How the flowers are done in negative silhouette and how the sukashi design when the tsuba is flipped are mirror images reminds me of Choshu as well as the seppa-dai and the hitsu ana shape. The overall size and shape of the tsuba makes me think late Edo (i.e. Bakumatsu) period. The mixture of techniques also makes me think late Edo. The good photo of the tsuba mimi or edge would be very helpful. Thank you for sharing photos of your nice tsuba.

 

 

 

Yours truly,

David S. (Soshin)

 

Hallo David

Have tried without luck to both scan and photograph the mimi,sorry.

 

Regards

 

Roy

[Rich T]

Greetings all, so I think these tsuba, while they show traits of Satome work, are classic early Edo Umetada school tsuba. Their 50/50 negative positive designs were very very popular with some of the early Edo artisans. Umetada Tadatsugu was a very prolific creator of these types of tsuba. I have a very simple version of this style heavily covered in Urushi

 

http://kodogunosekai.com/2009/12/05/ume ... shi-tsuba/

 

I also know there are similar tsuba attributed to Shoami, and Ko Shoami also. I have never thought them to be Kamakura Bori though as I do not think them to be that early, as in pre Momoyama. Satome ? not convinced with the bori on the surface.

 

Just my thoughts.

 

Cheers

 

Rich

[Soshin]

  Rich T said:

Greetings all, so I think these tsuba, while they show traits of Satome work, are classic early Edo Umetada school tsuba. Their 50/50 negative positive designs were very very popular with some of the early Edo artisans. Umetada Tadatsugu was a very prolific creator of these types of tsuba. I have a very simple version of this style heavily covered in Urushi

 

http://kodogunosekai.com/2009/12/05/ume ... shi-tsuba/

 

I also know there are similar tsuba attributed to Shoami, and Ko Shoami also. I have never thought them to be Kamakura Bori though as I do not think them to be that early, as in pre Momoyama. Satome ? not convinced with the bori on the surface.

Rich

Rich, thank you so much for replying to this tread. After rereading you entry in your blog about the Umetada school I think you are correct about what shool this tsuba belongs to. I have not seen many Umetada tsuba in hand and have only seen one and that tsuba dated to the mid Edo as it had a confirmed signature on it.

As for the issue of Kamakura Bori I would like to offer some more helpful information. The technique know as Kamakura Bori is named after a similar looking wood carving technique used in engravings. So, it has nothing to do with the place "Kamakura" in Sagami Province and also nothing to do with the Kamakura period (1192 - 1333) of Japan. Here is a example of the Kamakura Bori wood carving technique. The Kamakura Bori technique was used in tsuba during the Momoyama and Edo periods.

 

 

 

Yours truly,

David S. (Soshin)

[Mike]

Thanks Rich,

That is interesting observation, I am lacking of knowledge about Umetada school, so this is a good time to start catching up.

Thanks again,

Mike