N00b with a katana help

[zeugmax]

Hey there,

 

I have recently come into possession of an old samurai sword. I don't know a thing about it. It appears to be fairly old, maybe 150 years? Honestly i have no idea. I looked up the crest on the sqord and it matches one used by the Tokugawa shogunate (thanks, wikipedia!) which was from the 1600s to the 1850s.

This sword has been used, and i think quite a bit. There are small nicks in the blade on the front edge and the back, and the blade itself is weathered with some grimy rust. I am nervous to clean it.

Can someone please look at the photo and let me know if you know anything about it, or what it might be worth? I don't plan on selling it but it would be good to know in case i need to insure it.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

 

Thanks!

[zeugmax]

couple more shots...

[zeugmax]

Lots of views... no responses?

[Stephen]

oil the blade ASAP please, wipe oi on wipe off, wipe oil on wipe off, wipe on leave it, light coat, not hard wiping but best done in one direction up the blade. Looks like it might have a great potential, I'm sure well all want to see the nakago. First things first try to knock down red rust, it never sleeps.

[zeugmax]

thanks. are there any good video instructions or specific materials i should get? i'm a little new at this so i'm nervous.

 

thanks for your help!!

[IanB]

Dear Person, It is a rule on this board that you sign your posts. What you have is one of a species of sword mounted during the Meiji period to sell to tourists. They come in all manner of variants from wakizashi to tachi. The one you have, with the hilt covered with rayskin, I have never seen before. Most tachi have the hilt covered with the brass stampings with Tokugawa kamon, as your scabbard is. I don't expect to find your sword has a great blade, but they sometimes have reasonable quality blades. It was after all a period when there were tens of thousands of blades on the market, the only real demand being the tourist industry.

Ian Bottomley

[zeugmax]

THanks, I'll see if i can take it apart and post more pictures. I looked up the Meiji period and it was just after the tokugawa period... from the 1860s to 1912. The blade seems to have been used... it has small nicks on the blade and a small cut on the back of the blade. I'll see if i can capture that in my next set of pictures.

 

I'm hoping the mystery of this thing unravels. I still think it's a beautiful sword.

[zeugmax]

added a signature to please.

[Stephen]

Ian really youve never seen same coverd tsuka on a tachi? seen a few prestaton swords like that, and as you have said mostly Menji era as this looks to be, but sure they did it a lot longer ago than that. scan from Sword and Same.

cant remember what was on the first ed The Japanese Sword: A Comprehensive Guide ? old timers working brain i have.

[zeugmax]

Ok i am posting a picture of the handle with the signature on it. It's really rusted so i took the best pictures i could, and traced the Japanese and show it next to it (please feel free to laugh at my interpretation of the writing)...

 

Anyway, here it is. What do you think?

[zeugmax]

hmm. trying again

[Stephen]

Bishu Osafune Sukesada

[zeugmax]

btw what is that handle covering anyway? lizard skin? feels like hard bumpy plastic but i don't think it is...

[zeugmax]

who is that? Bishu Osafune Sukesada

[ottou812]

Is zeugmax your real name? If it's not, please sign your posts with your real name and not with your forum name.

 

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=6818

[blades87]

Hi, Zeug.

 

The hilt (tsuka) is traditionally covered in ray skin (samegawa) because the ray skin is coarse and provides grip for the hilt wrapping (tsuka ito).

 

Out of courtesy and respect for the members on this forum, many who experts on traditionally made Japanese swords (Nihonto), we ask the people who post questions sign their first name. There are a few people out there who use the knowledge of the members in order to secretly promote the sale of their swords. While the forum is here to help individuals and does assist individuals who do sell their collections, we ask that people be up front about their intentions, which is why the NMB has a policy of signing posts with a name. People like Stephen, Grey, Jean, John S., Ford and a whole host of other individuals have a wealth of knowledge they are willing to share with the forum. I am new to collecting Japanese swords and there are a lot of folks who have shared there knowledge with me, which I, in turn, share with others.

 

It's simply a matter of etiquette and respect.

 

Check out the links at the top of the forum to get more information on swords, koshiare (fittings), swordsmiths, kanji and a whole host of other information that will expand your knowledge on Japanese swords.

 

 

Cheers,

[machinist]

btw what is that handle covering anyway? lizard skin? feels like hard bumpy plastic but i don't think it is...

"Same" Sah-meh I think is how it is pronounced is the skin off the back of a ray.

 

Edit to add that I did not see Toby's post so mine is redundant

[zeugmax]

Sorry, i'm always a little reluctant to do that. I've changed it now. I wikid it and found the sword is a Tachi, slightly longer than a katana, for it was used for horseback fighting...and was sometime in the early 1500s. Anyone have any more insight on this sword or swordmaker, or the design of the sheath?

[zeugmax]

My sword is rusted fairly badly...is there any way to restore it to its original luster ? Seems like it needs a lot of work. I found online that you get a kit and you wipe it 3 times. seems like you need a sandblaster for mine instead. I'm a little jealous of other blades out there with perfect sheen.

[watsonmil]

Dear Damien,

That perfect sheen you're talking about often costs $ 125.00 an inch or more depending upon the quality of polish, and the polisher. Never use the words .... sand blasting .... sand paper .... emery cloth .... steel wool .... around here. That's akin to singing rugby songs in a church choir ! You can use a good quality oil ( even 3 in 1 ) with a soft cloth to remove a little of the rust, ... and clean that off with again a soft cloth and then re-post photos trying to capture the tempering in the point ( boshi ), and another trying to capture the tempering in the hamon ( along the cutting edge ). It will go a long way to getting you some expert advice as to the quality of the blade etc. Many Japanese swords are historically important objects and often serious works of art, and should be shown deep respect. Most are simply high quality weapons, ... but their study is a long and tedious task albeit for most of us enjoyable. Your best bet is to buy a couple no make that a dozen books on the subject and READ before you commit yourself to the masochistic mystique of collecting. Kind regards, ... Ron Watson

[zeugmax]

Thanks for that.

I wasn't really serious when i mentioned the sand blasting. I slightly exaggerated my observations that it might take some tiny bit of effort to remove the rust.

[Stephen]

who is that? Bishu Osafune Sukesada

 

the sword maker the school covered many Gen.

[zeugmax]

Do you have a good reference link i can read up on? The ones i find are snippets, doesn't give me a big picture. i'd be curious to find what timeframe the sword was made...

[Stephen]

Hawleys has ten pages of Sukesada's X twenty per page(with some of the repeats of dif ways signed) its very hard to narrow down, thats why we need to turn to the blade, we on the forum cant give you answers with out a better understanding of what activity of hada n hamon it has, the mei also is the the best cut Sukesada ive seen so it may have been added to sell the sword. in Nihonto open one door theres ten more, please dont relay on members to open each one for you.

[IanB]

Stephen, I am sorry I didn't make myself clear. When I said I hadn't seen a same covered tsuka on a tachi, I meant on one of these brass covered tachi made in the Meiji period. I have of course seen loads of real tachi with same tsuka. As I said, these Meiji items normally have the tsuka covered with brass sheet like the scabbard. In this genre I have seen tanto, wakizashi and tachi, all with identical stamped panels. It must have been quite a cottage industry turning them out. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Ian Bottomley

[blades87]

Nice looking tachi, Damien.

 

As for polishing the sword, I would recommend letting a professional sword polisher (togishi) restore your sword, given its age, type and condition. Fred Lohman offers polishing services, as does Jon Bowhay and a whole bunch of other very qualified individuals who are on this forum. I would recommend finding a togishi who is located near your town. Check out the Links section of the forum to learn more about some of the restoration services.

 

Cheers,

[Stephen]

one of the recommend polishers is highly trained, the other service varies greatly. Lets see the full nakago and area under the habaki.

[zeugmax]

Thanks, i'll look up Fred Lohman and work my way from there. Are they able to restore it to its original state? or do you think it's a lost cause?

 

also, on the name etching, i did try some photoshop techniques to increase the sharpness and clarity to the name, which is why the sukesada looked so well-cut. It was a little faded and at least one character was really tough to be seen, i had to take the picture a few times and use photoshop to bring out the visbility wher eit would be read by someone on this message board. taking the sword apart was a little scary for me, but now that i've done it it's not a problem. Neat to see how that all works.

[John A Stuart]

Hi Damien, May I suggest you get the sword evaluated before you send it to Lohman's for a polish? First, do you actually know who he gets to polish swords? John Bowhay, a Japanese trained togishi wouldn't polish a crapper. Take your time and assess a little better your options. I know the hazards of haste in this game, trust me. John

[zeugmax]

Hey guys, i don't know why i didn't look on the other side of the blade beforehand...but today i did. there is more japanes writing ont he other side of the blade... can someone look at it and translate?

 

I know there is a #2 in there = and the last 2 characters i think is Japan.

 

Help?