Kicking the hornets nest question ;)

[obiwanknabbe]

Over the years I have seen many such items for sale on ebay and other sites. Cut off Nakago, from wartime destroyed swords; sometimes with Mei, sometimes not.  Part one of the question, do these really have any historical significance in the collector community or are they merely trinkets/curiosities? Mei examples for comparison seems plausible but not likely reliable as the rest of the sword is missing making conclusive kantei murky at best.

 

Part 2, especially concerning unsigned examples, what is the concensus about further cutting these up and reusing the antique steel to forge new traditionally made blades? I'm of the understanding that the steel used in older swords (like from the koto period and earlier) is not replicatable today due to trace elements that were only pesent in the ore at that time.

 

Have at it!

 

Kurt

[Bugyotsuji]

All good questions, Kurt. There may be no monetary value, although the ones on eBay are probably hopeful, but to some people these can interesting and special study pieces. Show what you find to people and collect opinions before making up your mind how to proceed.

 

A friend here has reformed a couple into handy knife blades, keeping the best section of ji and hamon visible, if still available.

[Mikaveli]

I bought one, purely because I wanted to look at the cross-section and composition.

 

Obviously, without it being a known or highly skilled smith, the use of this is limited, but it was still interesting enough for me to buy.

 

If I could ever find one of one of my favourite smiths, whilst I'd shed an inter tear for the loss, I'd be something I'd pay good money for (not sure how many would possibly fit into that category though - seems mainly mumei and arsenal blades).

[The Forest Ninja]

4 hours ago, obiwanknabbe said:

what is the concensus about further cutting these up and reusing the antique steel to forge new traditionally made blades?

 

One issue that be that may present itself is most Katanas were forged using Kobuse style with a softer steel sandwiched in between harder steel.

So using a broken or older blade to forge a new Katana if it's folded again would mix those two types of steel together. If You're only going to be 

forging a knife or tanto it would be a non issue though.

 

[Gakusee]

12 minutes ago, The Forest Ninja said:

 

One issue that be that may present itself is most Katanas were forged using Kobuse style with a softer steel sandwiched in between harder steel.

So using a broken or older blade to forge a new Katana if it's folded again would mix those two types of steel together. If You're only going to be 

forging a knife or tanto it would be a non issue though.

 

Not really an issue. How do you think smiths reuse material from cracked blades (yes, it does happen) or blades they do not approve of for presentation to their clients, which they subsequently reforge. 

Smiths control the forging process by choosing pieces with higher and lower carbon. They do that with tamahagane and also other materials in order to achieved the desired result. So they could for instance use lower-carbon tamahagane pieces for the softer core and then the repurposed older blade remnants (with some added higher carbon tamahagane pieces). 

[Scogg]

Recently a video was shared by @Lewis B, that shows a modern swordsmith using pieces of broken old blades in his smithing. 

Timestamp  @  11:15 you can see that part 

https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/51569-another-fascinating-and-informative-hok-video-on-nihonto-blade-making/#comment-538926
 

 

[ROKUJURO]

As referenced above, cut-up blades are a good material source, but they will have to be recycled in an OROSHIGANE kiln or in early stages of forging a billet.
I use them for research and - in case enough material is left - to make knives or tools of them. The sale is only allowed if the sharp blade section is not longer than 150 mm.

When the blades are cut up in Japan, the authorities have the value of confiscated blades checked before they are destroyed. This is what I have been told.

[DKR]

I made this mekugi nuki from a dead blade.

It worried some people a lot  when they see it the first time. 

In the past I see a mekugi nuki with a  signature from Kotetsu.

The owner explain that it was from a cracked blade .