Curiosity

[Jean]

https://www.aoi-art.com/auction/en/auct ... 1213703271

 

Surprising, why? and among all members who have seen it today, who have noticed it?

[John A Stuart]

What's up Jean? A little expensive, but, nice koshirae and tanto is in good shape. John

[Jacques]

Hi,

 

Really too much expensive for a chu-jo saku

 

 

 

and he was a son of Wakasa no kami Ujifusa.

 

 

I think it is the contrary

[Jean]

Yes Jacques, I agree with you.

 

But considering the blade in itself, I was a bit surprised but the curiosity lies in the yasurime, they are outstanding on sashi omote and have disappeared on sashi ura.

 

Yes, very shape blade

 

Considering the price I am a bit surprised but after looking at Iida Koendo one, I don't know, but the mitokoromono must be for something in the price (coming from a great family?)

[John A Stuart]

I think Jean, you have called it right, the koshirae is at least half the price, Goto? Jacques noticed the error with who was the son of whom, of course Ujifusa is the son of Kanefusa, at least if this is the correct Kanefusa. My Kaneyoshi tanto shows similar yasurimei although the yasuri on the ura is still lightly visible, but, a pale shadow of the omote. Do you see yasuri on the bit just below the lowest ana? I think I see it faintly. John

[Jean]

Hi John,

 

I remember a naginata naoshi on Darcy's site a few years ago giving details on Kanefusa :

(found it) http://www.nihonto.ca/kanefusa/index.html

 

I would place this one as Kodai after Tenmon -

 

Bob Cole smith rating database gives a Jo saku level to Kanefusa, but as most seki smith lineage, I think they go from Chu to Chu Jo saku (there are always oustanding blades).

 

I would be interested in Ted opinion, as polisher, or other NMB members on the why of the wear of yasurime on sashi ura ....

 

Here on the pictures, it is obvious - so fresh on one side ans almost totally erased on the other side

 

The topic is interesting and I encourage people in looking at different sue Muromachi nakago and look at the yasurime wear on both side -

[Lorenzo]

Aoi art itself has another longer one here with less "artificial" aspect in my opinion:

http://www.aoi-art.com/sword/wakizashi/05237.html

[Jean]

Lorenzo,

 

Notice the yasurime on nakago both sides - almost same wear

[Lorenzo]

That's what I was trying to say

[Ted Tenold]

Jean,

 

I'm not sure I have a good answer for you on why the yasuri are stronger on one side than the other. One might suspect that a date or some dubious information might have been removed from just one side, but the faded areas are not in the place were an inscription would likely be found, and two examples of the same observation is pretty conincidental. What I notice is that both tanto have multiple mekugiana of which some have been filled. I wonder if in the old days, the plugs were installed flush on the side of the nakago with the mei, and the opposing unsigned side the plugs filed down slightly altering the surrounding yasuri(?). This would preserve the mei side and put the bulk of alteration on the unsigned side. This is *purely* speculation on my part though. I can't explain it otherwise... Might be worth researching other examples, especially those that are ubu with one mekugi ana. Perhaps the yasuri were just lighter handed on one side and are more prone to errosion by contact with the wood interior of the tsuka. Or, perhaps the mei stands proud enough to sheild the yasuri on that side from the same contact. Again...

 

I think the price of this piece reflects the whole package; a very healthy well preserved blade, a lovely high quality koshirae, and an elegant box for all. One certainly would be hard pressed to assemble such a package today for the same price.

[Eric H]

Perhaps the yasuri were just lighter handed on one side and are more prone to errosion by contact with the wood interior of the tsuka

I think that is rather unlikely taking in consideration the clearly visible file marks on omote. I have added a pic with two other Nakago of this Kanefusa. In the middle a sunnobi Tanto 34.8 cm dated Eiroku 10 (1567) and next also a sunnobi Tanto 34 cm, 1573. Contrarily to the Aoi-Tanto, here is no Yasurime visible in contrast to that by "Lorenzo", where traces of Yasurime can be seen. I had to "cut" the rightmost Nakago to get all three on the page.

Eric

[Veli]

Hi!

 

In my (not the same generation) Kanefusa tanto there are also differently preserved yasurime; worn but clear higaki on the ura, very faint sujikai (probably originally also higaki?) on the omote; it also seems that higaki starts to resemble sujikai when subjected to wear. The smith has maybe unintentionally used different force when filing in different directions? This is probably a question how the last faint remnants of yasurime are visible... There probably need to be only the slightest difference of wear between ura and omote to display this phenomenon.

 

Sorry for the use of bandwidth, need to upload hi-res pics to show the details...

 

 

 

BR, Veli

[Ted Tenold]

I think that is rather unlikely taking in consideration the clearly visible file marks on omote. Eric

 

No argument from me Eric. It was a pretty "soft" speculation. :lol: Better to have the pieces in hand as none of the images really show us the amount of details and topography we need.

[Jean]

In fact, one must not compare tanto by Kanefusa but rather tanto nakago of the same period and notice the way Yasurime show on both side 450/480 years later. here is a spicture of my kanetomo (a bit older -end of 15th century beginning of 16th) yasurime hardly visible on both side. The Kanefusa one on sashi omote are/seem too deep for the age

[Eric H]

While reading Clive Sinclaire's excellent article the "Real last Samurai" I have found another Tanto by Kanefusa of historical importance.

 

This 16th century Mino tanto by Kanefusa, now in the BM, was presented to Lord Redesdale for being an official witness to the seppuku of Taki Zenzaburo.

 

Eric

[loui]

Jean,

What I notice is that both tanto have multiple mekugiana of which some have been filled. I wonder if in the old days, the plugs were installed flush on the side of the nakago with the mei, and the opposing unsigned side the plugs filed down slightly altering the surrounding yasuri(?). This would preserve the mei side and put the bulk of alteration on the unsigned side. This is *purely* speculation on my part though. I can't explain it otherwise... .

 

I've filled mekugi ana with copper and lead, very little if any alteration to the surrounding yasurimei would have to be done in either case. To me, and this is speculation as well, it looks like something was removed from that side, looks like the edge of the groove is pushed in slightly from tapping out a signature perhaps, the curved markings in the nakago are also a little "different". And, on the other hand the yasurimei look pretty poorly carried out. All this doesn't mean good or bad, just that it's good for speculation on the NMB:) It's very interesting that either a smith or someone removing or adding filemarks made/left one side different from the other.

 

Very good eye for spotting that one!

 

Regards,

 

Louis

[Jean]

Hi Louis,

 

Very good eye for spotting that one!

 

I have spent a lot of bucks in my life to learn to observe and see. Many people look at something but don't see it really.

 

I agree with what you said but the "why" escapes me