Mark S. Posted January 4 Report Posted January 4 Please excuse if this has been asked/answered before. Wasn’t sure what term to use in search function. Found this example on line and have seen it before. There is a distinct line on the nakago of this suriage blade. Was it a ‘guide’ for the person shortening the blade or was it placed to determine ‘old’ from ‘new’? Very obviously on this blade, it differentiates the where the file marks change. Not all suriage blades have this mark. Finally, does this line have a ‘name’? Any discussion or thoughts on this are invited. Interesting also is that (to me) the upper mekugi-ana seem older than the lower one, which you would think would be opposite. 1 Quote
Lewis B Posted January 4 Report Posted January 4 IMO it's where a habaki was once located prior to a previous suriage event. Quote
Matsunoki Posted January 4 Report Posted January 4 Have seen similar lines caused by loose fitting seppa rattling around. Quote
Geraint Posted January 4 Report Posted January 4 Dear Mark. While I hesitate to disagree with my two august companions I fear that I must. It would be useful to see the whole of the nakago but no habaki shi would mark the nakago to show where the habaki should finish and I think the presence of kiri yasurime above the line confirms this as there would be none beneath the habaki. Nor do I think that a loose seppa would cause wear as they are almost universally made from copper, sometimes foiled in shakudo, silver or gold. In any of these cases it would be the much softer metal of the seppa that would take the wear. Having said that I certainly own blades where the prolonged wear from an iron tsuba has caused a shallow and slightly diffuse groove but not one with the characteristics of the example that you show. Example here. Assuming that we accept that this blade has had suriage performed then I believe what you are seeing is where the shape of the nakago has been adjusted to ensure a good fit in the tsuka and for the habaki. If you are interested in exploring this more then 'Facts and Fundamentals' has some enlightening sections on the nakago though I have not found a specific name for the clear change in yasurime that you illustrate. All the best. 6 Quote
Mark S. Posted January 4 Author Report Posted January 4 As the blade is for sale on a Japanese Dealers website, I didn’t post the whole picture. I’m not deciding to buy it, I was just using it because it had a clear photo of what I was asking about. If posting the whole nakago is an issue, I’ll ask Brian to delete. Quote
Tcat Posted January 4 Report Posted January 4 4 hours ago, Geraint said: Having said that I certainly own blades where the prolonged wear from an iron tsuba has caused a shallow and slightly diffuse groove but not one with the characteristics of the example that you show. Just want to add that its probably not only 'wear' that does this to the area around the tsuba - its moisture and corrosion / rust which builds up layer upon layer due to the damp finding a place to collect, condense and react repetedly through years of neglect / poor storage. Quote
Okan Posted January 4 Report Posted January 4 When I saw the title I thought someone had found an Ichimonji..and then this. 3 Quote
Mark S. Posted January 5 Author Report Posted January 5 4 hours ago, Lewis B said: Would this be another example? Looks like it. Quote
Tcat Posted January 5 Report Posted January 5 Pure speculation here but I'm going to 'hazard' a guess just for fun - perhaps it is to indicate where the original yasurime begin / end to differentiate between newer ones made at the time of the alteration. 1 Quote
Scogg Posted January 5 Report Posted January 5 https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/50881-fs-mumei-katana-w-shirasaya-nthk-npo/#comment-531411 Here is another example, posted in our For Sale section. This one is quite a bit lower, closer to the nakagojiri Cheers, -Sam Quote
Mark S. Posted January 5 Author Report Posted January 5 I guess you know why I’m asking then. The example I chose was just a little clearer than the one I own now. Just wanted to learn more. 1 Quote
NewB Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 I read somewhere long long time ago that had some meaning. Unfortunately the article is long gone.. no im not confusing it ichimonji it would seem unpractical to shorten the blade furthermore in case the nakago is still good.. It’d be like uchi gatana at 28” 1/4 nagasa?? just my approach y 1 Quote
Gerry Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 On 1/4/2025 at 10:03 AM, Mark S. said: Please excuse if this has been asked/answered before. Wasn’t sure what term to use in search function. Found this example on line and have seen it before. There is a distinct line on the nakago of this suriage blade. Was it a ‘guide’ for the person shortening the blade or was it placed to determine ‘old’ from ‘new’? Very obviously on this blade, it differentiates the where the file marks change. Not all suriage blades have this mark. Finally, does this line have a ‘name’? Any discussion or thoughts on this are invited. Interesting also is that (to me) the upper mekugi-ana seem older than the lower one, which you would think would be opposite. It's where the original nakago line ended before the sword underwent machi okuri/suriage. Quote
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