Ovals as signature?

[JeanEB]

Hi, I'd appreciate if somebody could enlighten me on this. I saw a sword for auction which doesn't have the usual signature on the nakago, but rather these stamps, three ovals/links and what looks like an F. I've never seen this so I don't know what it means, would appreciate any help

[Nihonto student]

Dear Jean,

 

I can't help you with the interpretation of the oval signs, but I don't see the shinogi and this is very suspicious...

[DRDave]

I've not seen the three ovals before, but I wonder if what looks like an F might actually be some form of 五

[JeanEB]

Thanks Giordy and Dave, I was working under the impression that the shinogi was just severely worn down as I was sorta guessing that the nakago had rust going back to at least early Muromachi (if genuine). if anything, the rest of the blade looked seemingly alright to my very novice eye. 

[Nihonto student]

Dear Jean,

 

no hada and the "hamon" seems artificially made, I don't see anything good so I suggest you to pass this time and save your money for something worth...
in the meantime, carefully read the section dedicated to fakes (Nihontoinfo>research>fake Japanese swords) and also try to see as many blades as possible, focusing on the individual details (Hada, hamon etc..).
Train your eye to look at what is good and what is not need time and study... take your time to understand and to create your personal taste regarding the periods/authors/works, in this way I can assure you that you will be much more satisfied with your purchase... don't rush, there are always blades on sale.

 

All the best

 

Giordy

 

 

[Jacques]

Blade with shinogi and nakago without shinogi = fake

[2devnul]

Well ... not always it is a fake Nihonto. Could it be old Korean sword? I'm not the expert, but I've seen genuine Korean swords which looked Nihonto alike. 

 

"There is a record that when Koreans obtained a Japanese sword, they would grind down the back and side slopes (shinogi) to make the sides flat and the edge angular."

ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_sword

 

Still, patina doesn't look that old (Imjin war - Muromachi), but that is just my opinion based on the pictures.