Tsuba purchasing on eBay

[Dan tsuba]

Hello all!

 

So, I just wanted to share how I purchase tsuba on eBay.  I have been doing this for almost 6 years and have about 150 tsuba. Out of those 150 tsuba I have purchased 149 of them from eBay (and only about 5 of those through the bidding process!).

 

I don’t like to bid on a tsuba.  For me, that takes too much effort and time.  Sometimes you must wake up in the early hours of the morning as the bid is ending to place your final bid and you may end up paying more than you wanted as you tend to increase your bid to outbid someone else.

 

So, you see a tsuba you like on eBay.  You have discerned that it is an actual (not a fake or reproduction) antique tsuba and most likely made in the Edo period.

 

Your research is based on several good beginner’s books that are out there, or you can refer to this thread for a quick reference-

 

https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/47395-tsuba-purchasing-for-new-collectors/

 

Now you are on eBay and see a nice tsuba that you want to purchase.  Of course, if it is within your price range you may just decide to purchase it!

 

Or there is something else you can do!

 

If you look on the upper right-hand side of the page (below the description of the tsuba) you will notice an area on the far right that states “Contact seller”.  If you click on that it will take you to another screen where you can find out about details of the piece, shipping, or returns.

 

However, at the bottom of that screen is an area labeled “Still have questions” and on the right of that is an area labeled “Contact seller”.

 

Now, if you are not in a hurry to purchase the piece (and by using this method you may lose the piece to someone else who has bought it by paying the full price) you can click on the “Contact seller” box and send a message to the seller.

 

I have sent messages to several sellers when I see I piece I would like, but it is maybe just a little too expensive for me to afford.

 

I tell the seller how much I am willing to pay for the tsuba and if he would please consider my offer.

 

On several occasions, the seller has accepted my offer or we discuss a price that both of us think is a fair price for the piece.

 

That is the technique I use when the seller has not listed a “Make offer” box with the listing.

 

Sometimes, you don’t have to end up paying the full price shown for the item on the eBay listing!

 

One other thing to be aware of when purchasing tsuba on eBay is the shipping charge.

 

Some sellers offer free shipping from Japan.  While other sellers usually charge anywhere from $20 to $40!  The shipping charge can be seen under the price of the displayed item.

 

Just trying to help some of the newer members that may be trying to purchase tsuba on eBay by relating the method that I have used successfully.

 

Onward!

 

 

[Lewis B]

Never tried to use a sniping tool? I usually place bids this way on Ebay. Set max bid amount and the bid will be placed approx 5 s before the end of the auction. This removes the inconvenience of having to manually bid no matter what time the auction ends. 

[lonely panet]

149 ebay tsuba omg

 This dosnt sound good

[Dan tsuba]

Hello, lonely panet.

I try to help new collectors, and then you stated-

 

“149 ebay tsuba omg

 This dosnt sound good”

 

What is up with that? 

You haven’t seen my collection or know the values that I achieved through my purchases through eBay.

What are you, a tsuba dealer who doesn’t want people to buy tsuba from eBay?

Either state something positive for new collectors, or don’t say anything at all (especially about my tsuba collection that I purchased over the years from eBay!).

 

Just my opinion.

[Spartancrest]

3 minutes ago, Dan tsuba said:

This dosnt sound good

No this statement doesn't sound good either - 

 

 

[George KN]

Thanks for the tips Dan! 

 

Any good ways of ruling out the fakes? Or how to properly value a tsuba?

[Winchester]

I think your heart is in the right place Dan and if it makes you happy, keep on keeping on. 

Maybe someone will benefit by your post? Everyone has different budgets and interests; this could be a way for someone to purchase that maybe they couldn’t otherwise. Who knows?

 

 

[Dan tsuba]

Hi George!

 

Nice to meet you!

 

As far as ruling out the fakes, I would like to refer you again to this thread (which you probably already read!)-

 

https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/47395-tsuba-purchasing-for-new-collectors/

 

Over my 6 years of tsuba collecting there have been several members that have been of great and valuable help and assistance to me.

 

One of those members has a forum name of Spartancrest.

 

Perhaps if you PM (Personal Message) him he can further assist you on how to rule out the fakes and how to properly value a tsuba.

 

Although, because of his expertise, I am sure the guy probably is inundated with PM’s and emails!

 

But you can always give it a try!

 

Onward!

[Okan]

Here’s some excellent advice for new collectors from the late Darcy. Thought I’d share it here in his memory!

 

"For a collector, this small range in valuation differences between the mediocre and great is something that can be taken advantage of, no matter what your spending level, as small increments in valuation give rapidly increasing rewards for rarity, interest, and quality. 

 

This is the primary reason why it is a mistake to accumulate large numbers of items, because concentrating the same funds into fewer and more important works yields excellent results in these collecting domains.

 

There has to be a reason to buy something. More than just liking it, because there are a lot of things out there to like and they do deserve being liked. Owning is a different set of criteria however.

 

If you end up with the dreaded accumulation of stuff you will have missed much more interesting paths in exchange for simple quantity. " 

[Spartancrest]

1 minute ago, Dan tsuba said:

I am sure the guy probably is inundated with PM’s and emails!

Thanks Dan, but you didn't mention my Hemorrhoids from long hours sitting at the computer.  

[not true - no Hemorrhoids - but that would explain me being a pain in the a***   ]

[Dan tsuba]

First to address the post from Winchester (Brian).  You stated-

 

“I think your heart is in the right place Dan and if it makes you happy, keep on keeping on.”

 

Well Winchester I know my heart is in the right place, and I don't need you to think about it!

 

 

Then to address the post from Okan-

 

What you stated in that quote is only one person’s opinion. 

 

Not everybody has deep pockets, and some (like me) can only purchase stuff for their hobby on a month to month basis.

Please refer to this thread and my post of 11/22 at 12:44PM-

 

https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/50577-water-wheel-and-cherry-blossom/

 

Why does a simple post of mine trying to help people (which started this thread) have to become so overly complicated by some members?

[Okan]

You don't have to address this, that only one person's opinion is the most significant one when it comes to collecting and studying. I get that you may not afford expensive tsuba on a month to month basis, but some of the beginner collectors might want to wait a couple of months, even years, before making a new purchase... Like most of us do here.

 

[Dan tsuba]

Thanks Okan.

 

I understand and appreciate what you are saying.

 

And it is good advice to those that can save up their money!

 

Onward!

[Spartancrest]

43 minutes ago, Okan said:

This is the primary reason why it is a mistake to accumulate large numbers of items, because concentrating the same funds into fewer and more important works yields excellent results in these collecting domains.

The only trouble with this statement is - Who can tell what are the most important works? Several times people have said you need to wait to get the very best - but who says what is the best? That is always a personal judgement based on experience. New collectors don't have that experience and should not be force fed the opinions and tastes of other people. We would all love to collect the absolute best but I will guarantee that each of us will have a different view of what that means. Price never guarantees anything, so we can rule that right out of the equation. JMHO 

[PNSSHOGUN]

It's a good sentiment but all of this feels very much like teaching grandmother to suck eggs.....

 

A list of trusted sellers, who to avoid, useful search terms etc etc might be more helpful?

[Spartancrest]

I don't think this thread is directed to the "grandmothers"  - more to the children, that is the entire point!  

[lonely panet]

4 hours ago, Dan tsuba said:

Hello, lonely panet.

I try to help new collectors, and then you stated-

 

“149 ebay tsuba omg

 This dosnt sound good”

 

What is up with that? 

You haven’t seen my collection or know the values that I achieved through my purchases through eBay.

What are you, a tsuba dealer who doesn’t want people to buy tsuba from eBay?

Either state something positive for new collectors, or don’t say anything at all (especially about my tsuba collection that I purchased over the years from eBay!).

 

Just my opinion.

Ebay has  2 things. Crap tsuba and over priced tsuba.

 

 

Jauce is a far better option for the tsuba hunter if you know what your looking at

[Tensho]

Only thing I've ever gathered on here is that tsuba collecting is like modern art.. Some people will call this art and pay $6 million for it and others will scoff at it. 

 

 

Some will call this art and others will scoff at it. 

 

Buy what you like. 

[lonely panet]

Money is not a indicator of intelligence 

 

but monkeys do like bananas 

[Spartancrest]

Crap tsuba are of course not restricted to ebay 

https://www.zacke.at...nagatsune/?lot=63242   this is a fake for €1,300.00 

https://www.bonhams....period-19th-century/  same type of fake sold for  US$976

 

Two "respected" auction houses?  Who don't know their elbow from ..............   

 

 

Same fake minus the nice paint job on ebay https://www.ebay.com/itm/144617398691

A "better" fake also minus the paint on Jauce  https://www.jauce.com/auction/f1162467177  I say "better" because the hitsu have been cut through (crudely) by someone after they got their hands on it. Whereas the others have only got the hitsu stamped into the design. 

How does a new collector get past the lies that some sellers tell when describing these things?  I bet that the Bonhams' buyer is really pleased with his "WIN".            I wouldn't be happy!

PS Two sizes available - with or without the paint job.

[lonely panet]

I understand your approach dale but on a law of averages. Ebay vs jauce for honest tsuba at honest prices with honest descriptions. Jauce hands down.

 

Ebay is 95% rubbish now.

15-20  years ago it was good but now i wouldnt even shop there for sex toys

[Spartancrest]

54 minutes ago, lonely panet said:

Jauce hands down.

 

I do totally agree with you.  I buy 99% of my things from Jauce - they are reliable and a great deal of the time much cheaper [especially when the same object is selling on ebay] I am not so happy with the multiple fees but even taking that into account they still end up better value. It is a shame even Jauce is now allowing the crude fakes to appear, but at least they tend to be bunched together so you can easily skip them en-masse. 

Of course Jauce and Yahoo and Buyee tend to sell the same items, it just depends which company people like to deal with. I have been buying through Jauce for more than ten years now - why would I switch?

 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/286181606407  vs  https://www.jauce.com/auction/v1162501365  that is US $163.89 on ebay vs US $55.70 on Jauce

 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/286181606420  vs  https://www.jauce.com/auction/t1162476189   that is US $120.99 on ebay vs US $36.27 on Jauce

 

These are not insignificant price differences even with fees and shipping.

Edited Monday at 06:32 AM by Spartancrest
MORE LINKS

[lonely panet]

6 hours ago, Dan tsuba said:

Hello, lonely panet.

I try to help new collectors, and then you stated-

 

“149 ebay tsuba omg

 This dosnt sound good”

 

What is up with that? 

You haven’t seen my collection or know the values that I achieved through my purchases through eBay.

What are you, a tsuba dealer who doesn’t want people to buy tsuba from eBay?

Either state something positive for new collectors, or don’t say anything at all (especially about my tsuba collection that I purchased over the years from eBay!).

 

Just my opinion.

There you go snappy Dan. Positive comments. 

[PNSSHOGUN]

Good luck returning anything with Jauce or buyee. Yahoo Japan auctions are truly buyer beware.

[Spartancrest]

Just now, PNSSHOGUN said:

truly buyer beware

True - either way we lose because we have to pay the return shipping! Best to be sure first time around. 

Have you seen the shipping costs they put on somethings on ebay? I was buying a dog brooch for my wife [something she collects] $16- but the postage was $66 from the US. Give me a break, there is no justification for that. [NO SALE] 

[Robert S]

12 hours ago, Spartancrest said:

Crap tsuba are of course not restricted to ebay 

https://www.zacke.at...nagatsune/?lot=63242   this is a fake for €1,300.00 

https://www.bonhams....period-19th-century/  same type of fake sold for  US$976

 

Two "respected" auction houses?  Who don't know their elbow from ..............   

 

 

Same fake minus the nice paint job on ebay https://www.ebay.com/itm/144617398691

A "better" fake also minus the paint on Jauce  https://www.jauce.com/auction/f1162467177  I say "better" because the hitsu have been cut through (crudely) by someone after they got their hands on it. Whereas the others have only got the hitsu stamped into the design. 

How does a new collector get past the lies that some sellers tell when describing these things?  I bet that the Bonhams' buyer is really pleased with his "WIN".            I wouldn't be happy!

PS Two sizes available - with or without the paint job.

Wowzers.  I can't believe that Bonhams were fooled by that!  Even if you thought it was really antique, the quality is so horrible...

[cluckdaddy76]

Just to chime in, I am also now a huge fan of tsuba. I was lucky to acquire a large collection of many different items all at once, including 50 or so tsuba. I have been quietly studying away for some time now and have only posted a few times. Now that I have studied, I just do not see much on Ebay and rarely even look here and agree jauce is slightly better. My personal issue is now that I have learned more, I rarely see a tsuba I am interested in for much less than about $500 USD and then it goes up from there. I am also in the camp of if it makes you happy, keep doing it, so if you love your pieces Dan, keep on going. My concern with this type of $100 or so tsuba is that down the road if you needed to sell them, it may not be that easy where a quality piece would be more desired by collectors and easier to liquidate. Sure, someone can get what they feel is a great deal on a tsuba for say $50 and you value it at $150; so, in your mind this is good. However, if down the road you actually try to sell, I feel it may be a different story whether you get what you valued it at.  Once again, not knocking what anyone likes, but to me once you hold better quality work in your hand, it is hard to settle for less in my opinion.

 

Jason

[GeorgeLuucas]

No offense Dan, but your pride in your 150 tsuba in conjunction with your explanation that you can't afford nicer ones, really doesn't make any sense to me. 

Take the money you've invested in 150 eBay tsuba. Would you not have more enjoyment investing the same amount of money in say, 50 tsuba? Would the quality not increase a lot?

Is there a benefit or satisfaction to having 150 low-end tsuba versus 50 nicer ones? Or even, 25? 

Just trying to understand the 'why'.
Cheers,
-Sam

[Dan tsuba]

Hello Jason (and also Sam since I saw his recent post on this thread).

 

I started this thread to try and help new collectors negotiate the labyrinth of tsuba that are on eBay and maybe give them some useful tips.

 

And I do love my pieces, so I will keep doing what I have done for the past about 6 years.

 

My philosophy is “never change a winning game, always change a losing game”.

 

I feel that I have been winning in the way I acquire my pieces from eBay.

 

I have tried Jauce (and have acquired one piece from them).

 

But it was not a bid (like I stated before, bidding is not for me!), it was a buy it now.

 

I found out that with putting a required amount of money in Jauce before you can purchase, and with all the added fees attached and then the shipping; it just about equals what I could have bought the same tsuba for on eBay (especially if I communicated with the seller and was successful in negotiating a lower price with him for the piece).

 

Not only that, but the eBay pieces arrived in a timelier manner than the Jauce piece.

 

As I stated somewhere else on this forum (darn it, can’t remember the thread!) I am not interested in selling my tsuba.  I don’t purchase them to turn them around and make a profit (as I am sure many other collectors do).

 

I buy them, learn from them, give the lower quality tsuba a good home (until I pass and move on, as my collection will also move on!), and enjoy them by hanging them on several walls of the house and viewing them every day!

 

Also, I know that I have been fortunate enough to purchase quite a few quality pieces on eBay for under $150.  I know that because I have a very knowledgeable friend that studies tsuba and I have shown some of my tsuba to him and he has stated that I got a great deal for the price that I paid!

 

So, deals can still be had on eBay.  You just have to learn to discern and know what you are looking at (and you can always contact the seller and ask questions about the piece).

 

And yes, (and I also know I stated this on another thread-but again old age has made me forget where; I have to blame something!) I have been bit once or twice on my eBay purchases because of misleading seller pictures or other information.

 

But when I get bit, I don’t lose much money compared to someone else that has deep pockets and spends a lot more for a tsuba.

 

And when I have gotten bit, I have spent less than what many known and stated as such reproduction tsuba cost.  So, not a big loss and they still end up on my walls!

 

We all collect in different ways and for different reasons. 

 

I personally enjoy the challenge of finding a nice old, showing signs of possibly being mounted on a blade, possibly rusted (more than likely!) tsuba on eBay for about $150 (sometimes a little more, sometimes less).

 

Hey, that is just me!

 

Onward!

 

 

 

[Jussi Ekholm]

I think going wide is just as viable as going quality, in my opinion there is no correct way in collecting and enjoying the hobby. I can very well understand Dan. As to certain point I would be going similar way if I had funds. In my personal collection I would much rather have 10 middle tier swords than 1 high quality sword in comparison. To me that would be much more enjoyable.

 

I have a friend here in Finland who has 100+ tsuba along with very massive collection of all things Samurai. I always enjoy greatly viewing so large number of tsuba with huge variation in styles and quality as well. I know not everyone would like that but I try to enjoy items of all levels.