What is it?

[alaen305]

hi I need help what is this and is hand made

[John A Stuart]

Alaen, You show the date only. Showa ju ku nen ju ni gatsu. Dec 1944. John

[alaen305]

hello buy this sword on ebay and I doubt if it is original or fake please help good and bad opinions are WELCOME thanks this is the other side of the sword and the koshirae

[drbvac]

This a gunto - ww2 machine made sword but where did the original thread go - is this part of the old guys stuff ? Its not worth 10 grand either!! :?

[ottou812]

The original thread got threadjacked.

[alaen305]

:? hi then this sword is original or not and that thread is not leading but thought someone might break and try to put back the sword must be original, because otherwise I do not buy this kind of sword ,this is a trouble

and I buy another that seemed real but was fake chinese

[Jean]

Alaen,

 

First thing, have you ever seen in your life a Nihonto blade?

Have you ever seen in your life a tang, do you know what ubu means, do you know what yasurime means?

 

Go to museum, dealers. Handle swords .. Stay shut from e-bay

 

If not and if you want a Nihonto, go and see a reputable dealer, it will cost you some grands but there is less chance to get a fake.

 

Were I our humourous Reinhard, I should have posted, for you and the thousands who want to buy a Van Gogh without having seen one :

 

"Beati pauperes spiritu ...."

 

But it is time to be jolly :lol:

[Brian]

Alaen,

I have split the 2 topics you created to new posts. Please do NOT add your own question to someone else's.

Start a new topic, in the corretc section please. No thread hijacking.

 

Brian

[David Flynn]

A very late war gunto. Unless you're into militaria and not nihonto, really not worth collecting.

 

David

[simonjbinks]

We all have to start somewhere. Mine was a Bali-made jeep spring I bought in...Bali, in 1981. Luckily, in an attempt to show off my new-found Masamune (whom I had not heard of at the time), I made first contact with a very reputable local collector in Victoria, Australia (where I usually live) and he helped me greatly over almost thirty years to this day.

 

My second purchase was a fine mumei (no signature) suriage (shortened) blade with a Habaki made of Shakudo engraved "Yoshioka". It was a very fine blade I found in a pawn-shop in Broken Hill (country town on the edge of the Australian desert - I was touring as a rock musician).

 

I thought Yoshioka might be the prior owner's name, but then read of the famous Yoshioka kenjutsu (sword-fighting) school, against which Miyamoto Musashi had three famous battles. Musashi challenged Yoshioka Seijūrō, Master of the Yoshioka School, to a duel. Seijūrō lost. Yoshioka Denshichirōr then became Master of the Yoshioka school and challenged Musashi to a dual, which he also lost. Then the entire Yoshioka School challenged Musashi, who met the mass of skilled swordsmen alone at one-pine plane near Ichijoji Temple. Musashi won.

 

Maybe this belonged to one of the Samurai involved in that famous clash.

 

My long-winded point is, find yourself a mentor, as I did with the famous (in Australia at least) Barry Thomas, a wonderful, generous and intensely knowledgeable collector of many years, owning many fine blades. There is no better way. Books are great and necessary, but without reference to what sunagashi is, and someone who has a blade in polish who can point it out, it would be a long, expensive haul.

 

Of equal importance, many of Barry;s swords were in new polish, so Barry took the time to show me all the fine details you can read about but rarely recognize without extensive, expensive experience.

 

Find that mentor and READ, save your money until you have at least a working knowledge, but don't beat yourself up. We all have to start somewhere, and I would say that chances are, the first purchase is unlikely to be anything worth keeping. But you never know, until you put the time and effort in.

 

Grab a Barry Thomas, and cherish his intellect, experience and generosity, if you're as lucky as I was. Put the time in, glean what you can, and you will find a Barry Thomas. Then, the enchanting world of the Japanese ART sword will slowly reveal itself to you.

 

Oh, learn to read Japanese; critical and not that difficult.

 

AND...Hawley (A laudable accomplishment researching, listing and translating into English, all known swordsmiths from Amakuni - the considered founder of the Samurai sword as we know it, to smiths working into the 1970's) and Fujishiro (two books, one on the Koto {old sword} Period - 800 AD - 1596 and another on the Shinto {new Sword} Period - 1596 to 1781, but also includes the Shinshinto Period 1781-1876). These three books are the Bibles of sword-collectors.

 

Absolutely necessary. Get them.

 

Have fun, be excited by the hunt, enjoy the great finds, expect some false signatures (which may turn out to be good swords anyway, sometimes even better than the smith the forgery proclaimed).

 

Look past the fittings. Fine blades are often in subtle fittings, and visa versa. I turned down a mumei Masamune. A man who knew nothing about Japanese swords somehow gathered a collection of ten or fifteen swords. I had a collection of about 50 at the time, so was getting selective. I decided to buy only the best, and one tanto was mounted in what traditional Japanese would generally consider bad taste, an elaborate elephant koshirae. I bought about six swords, including a genuine Soshu Tsunehiro (1st Generation), a Heianjo Nagayoshi and an excellent tanto in Ebi Koshirae (lobster mounts - ribbed, red urushi (Japanese lacquer) saya and tsuka as one, with en suite shakudo kodugu including a kodzuka and kogai; all fine, matching by a famous artisan, well executed and not over-stated)

 

The best of Japanese art is usually considered what the Japanese call Shibui (beauty in simplicity - http://shibui.com/whatis.html) or Koroi (not sure of English spelling, means "just right"). This elephant monstrosity was neither, but the blade WAS a Masamune, I found out some time later, just before I threw myself off Sydney Harbour Bridge, into a garbage barge which contained a discarded Muramasa, edge up. I slide right past, so much for the legend.

 

There is an exception to every rule in the world of Nihonto, but once the hurdle of comprehension and appreciation is bridged; it is a fascinating and exciting world.

[drbvac]

All great except the bastardization of poor edmund burkes quote - may be true!

[loiner1965]

excellent and most enjoyable read....my first nihonto was way back in 1980s and was a kamakura period wakizashi which i foolishly sold only a few years ago and since then i been buying crap lol

[simonjbinks]

I have lived my life by the immortal words of Sir Edmund Burke. He would be turning in his grave at the sight of what Bush did to a great country.

[huntershooter]

Don't go there pal. You may not like the response.

Lets stick to Nihonto.

[Brian]

Agree completely. We are not going there.

 

Brian