Echizen Kinai shell tsuba

[Lukas P]

Hello guys,

 

I just came across this tsuba and was wondering about your opinion on the work. I am asking because I know there is a wealth of knowledge across the members and I am 'green' in this so trying to learn more about what to look for and 'how' to look (to distinguish the quiality of metal itself and metal work details, etc.).

 

For this piece I quite like aesthetically the shell motif. I would say that it has not been mounted on the sword and the punches on the seppa dai somehow do not seem 'convincing'. It is signed as Echizen Kinai and I did read a thread on this forum (about 1 year old) about another Echizen Kinai tsuba in which the member well explained that they did a lot of 'mass' production. I would say this is a typical representation of this mass production (just a mediocre tsuba), but other than that I would be curious about other observations by people who are more experienced than me. 

 

I will be very grateful for any insights and observations you guys have!

 

Best wishes

 

Lukas

[Brian]

Looks perfectly legit to me, and mounted properly. Needs some cleaning the correct way.

[SteveM]

Looks OK to me too. An often copied design (probably because its a good design, and a lot of people liked it), but it looks like a legitimate Kinai tsuba to me. The marks on the seppa dai look authentic.

 

Here's an example of the same design with gold inlay.

https://eirakudo.sho.../tsuba/detail/013805

 

Same one in square shape. (I prefer yours to this square one).

https://jp.mercari.c...en/item/m14494086929

[Curran]

Jah. It has been mounted and could use a little basic TLC.

But otherwise it is a CLASSIC Echizen example, and a seemingly nice one.

 

Looking past the orange light that makes the bits of rust look hot and difficult to see the iron, -- it looks very legit and nice to me.

I've rarely owned an Echizen, but this would be a nice reference example even to me.

Depending on the price and the amount of rust on the mimi, even my jaded self would consider buying it.

 

Good newbie question that makes me glad to help.

[Geraint]

Dear Lukas.

In agreement with the comments so far posted but just out of interest if you compare yours with the two examples that Steve helpfully posted you might find the exercise instructive.  Of the three I would pick yours.

 

All the best.

[Bugyotsuji]

Nice find!

(Abalone) shells feature throughout Japanese art, such as in Netsuké. There’s the food angle again, of course, but also the strange shape. In English they are sometimes called ‘ear shells’; you do find them used as ear-like tatemono on kabuto helmets.

One of my own favorites is a little iron awabi Tantō tsuba with sea-themed decorations, which I need to photograph one day. 

 

 

 

[Kurikata]

One abalone shell tsuba of mine signed Akao Yoshitsugu . Kinai and Aka o schools where using almost the same designs...

[Lukas P]

Dear all,

 

Thank you all so much for your opinions, replies and images. I am so glad I found this community of people sharing the same passion :-)

 

@Curran and @Brian, you both mention it has been mounted. Can I ask what do you base this on? Is it the linear punch next to nakago ana? Sorry, just want to learn to see things.

 

@Brian what kind of cleaning would you recommend? Is there some useful literature you could point me to potentially (can be for iron and even soft metal tsuba - very happy to study how to do things right)? 

 

Have a nice evening all and thanks once again!

 

Lukas

[mecox]

Lukas, that is a nice tsuba. Some examples and background in NMB downloads:

 

 

[ROKUJURO]

Lukas,

in case it is of interest to you: the depicted AWABI ( = Abalone) shells are not from a clam, but from a sea snail. The blue green AOGAI mother of pearl is made of these shells.

[Spartancrest]

What Jean said.  This one is twice the size of the fisherman's head!        [Delicious with black bean sauce JMHO]

 

I like your tsuba very much. [size wise they would still be "Abalini" 3 cm long? But I don't think they are to scale ]

[Spartancrest]

9 hours ago, Lukas P said:

it has been mounted. Can I ask what do you base this on?

The tagane-ato  [punch marks] has moved metal into the open space of the nakago-ana. The blue line shows how the metal has been pushed out from roughly the red line. This is only done to give a firm grip of the nakago [tang] of the sword it was mounted on.

 

 

You are correct to question this, as many "fakes" can have the punch marks cast into the design but they won't show that the metal has "moved". So yes yours has been mounted.

[Spartancrest]

One very similar in the Bristol Museums collection. https://collections....731/?s%3DN6852&pos=1

 

They have some confusion between "Butterfly wings" and "Abalone shells"    [I have taken the liberty of lightening the images]

 

[Lukas P]

10 hours ago, mecox said:

Lukas, that is a nice tsuba. Some examples and background in NMB downloads:

 

Wow, amazing study material, thank you Mal!

 

[Lukas P]

3 hours ago, Spartancrest said:

What Jean said.  This one is twice the size of the fisherman's head!        [Delicious with black bean sauce JMHO]

 

I like your tsuba very much. [size wise they would still be "Abalini" 3 cm long? But I don't think they are to scale ]

Hi Dale, yes, I remember when we were with my friend in New Zealand backpacking we saw these around quite a lot. Not as big as this one though, LOL... I remember I thought they were such a beautiful nature's creation - I totally understand why it is quite a common motif...

[Lukas P]

3 hours ago, Spartancrest said:

The tagane-ato  [punch marks] has moved metal into the open space of the nakago-ana. The blue line shows how the metal has been pushed out from roughly the red line. This is only done to give a firm grip of the nakago [tang] of the sword it was mounted on.

 

 

You are correct to question this, as many "fakes" can have the punch marks cast into the design but they won't show that the metal has "moved". So yes yours has been mounted.

Thank you Dale @Spartancrest for answering my question. I always thought the punch marks (tagane-ato) were used for 'holding' sekigane soft metal inserts in place (which is used as shock absorber from what I read, not only to reduce the size). So in my understanding does it mean that a sword can be mounted even without sekigane - assuming the size is right and if the nakao ana is punched so it sits tight? Sorry for stupid questions :-) Best wishes, Lukas

[Deez77]

Lukas,

 

I was looking at that tsuba as well. As others have already said, it appears legit and a nice representative one for the school at that. While the abalone shell motif is common for Kinai, it's not always easy to find good examples of that particular design. With some consistent rubbing, I imagine it would clean up nicely. Full disclosure, I collect this school and have also been watching it...may put in a bid. 

 

Example of a small tsuba I have of abalone attached for reference. 

Damon

[Bugyotsuji]

Not signed, so anyone’s guess as to region. Tanto tsuba, iron, with soft metalwork honzōgan inlays.

 

 

Mimi up close.

[Spartancrest]

So in my understanding does it mean that a sword can be mounted even without sekigane - assuming the size is right and if the nakao ana is punched so it sits tight? Sorry for stupid questions :-) Best wishes, Lukas

 

A tsuba can be mounted without sekigane and without tagane-ato if it was made for a specific sword. Tsuba could also be purchased with ready made nakago-ana and then adjusted to fit a blade either with sekigane or punched if the hole was too large, to stop any movement of the guard. There is also a group of makers who cut the top and bottom of the nakago-ana and put in what are called kuchibeni ["lipstick" or more accurately "Red mouth opening"] Suruga school for example. These were designed to hold sekigane in a horseshoe shape top and bottom. Sometimes these can be found with just the cut holes and the sekigane either removed or never put in.

    This [Suruga school] has kuchibeni and an added sekigane at the bottom

Then there are others where a filler has been made that covers the whole nakago-ana if for instance too much metal has been removed. 

 

Sekigane could be a research project just on their own! 

[Bugyotsuji]

Wakidaté 

 

 

[Lukas P]

7 hours ago, Spartancrest said:

So in my understanding does it mean that a sword can be mounted even without sekigane - assuming the size is right and if the nakao ana is punched so it sits tight? Sorry for stupid questions :-) Best wishes, Lukas

 

A tsuba can be mounted without sekigane and without tagane-ato if it was made for a specific sword. Tsuba could also be purchased with ready made nakago-ana and then adjusted to fit a blade either with sekigane or punched if the hole was too large, to stop any movement of the guard. There is also a group of makers who cut the top and bottom of the nakago-ana and put in what are called kuchibeni ["lipstick" or more accurately "Red mouth opening"] Suruga school for example. These were designed to hold sekigane in a horseshoe shape top and bottom. Sometimes these can be found with just the cut holes and the sekigane either removed or never put in.

This [Suruga school] has kuchibeni and an added sekigane at the bottom

Then there are others where a filler has been made that covers the whole nakago-ana if for instance too much metal has been removed. 

Sekigane could be a research project just on their own! 

Thanks so much for your explanation @Spartancrest! Really appreciate you took your time :-) Best, Lukas

[Lukas P]

6 hours ago, Bugyotsuji said:

Wakidaté 

 

Very interesting! Thank you for sharing.

[Lukas P]

8 hours ago, Deez77 said:

Lukas,

 

I was looking at that tsuba as well. As others have already said, it appears legit and a nice representative one for the school at that. While the abalone shell motif is common for Kinai, it's not always easy to find good examples of that particular design. With some consistent rubbing, I imagine it would clean up nicely. Full disclosure, I collect this school and have also been watching it...may put in a bid. 

 

Example of a small tsuba I have of abalone attached for reference. 

 

Damon

Hi Damon @Deez77, nice example and thanks for your helpful comments! And noted, gambatte ;-)  

[Rodenbacher]

I have a very similar one, it's nearly identic to yours, but unsigned. So yes, mass production, but it's nevertheless a very well made tsuba and I like it a lot. (And: no, it's not a cast copy!)