Chicago Sword Show Buy - 2 Different Papers. Opinions?

[waljamada]

Just got back from this year's Chicago Sword Show and it was chock full of blades, tsuba, menuki, koshirae and everything one could want!  The range of items was so much fun to go through.  I was there more just to peruse but also to help a new collector find a blade with a limited budget of $1K and I'm here to share the blade he picked.  The blade has a 26" nagasa, naginata-hi and a small o-kissaki.  It is a mumei blade with two old papers, one from the nthk and one from the nbthk.  One is papered to Sue Mihara and the other says Masaki Takata?   Looking for any insight and opinions I can share with this new collector on his blade and maybe understand the papers a bit more.  I believe this to be a muroumachi era blade but beyond that I'm unsure.

[waljamada]

Here are the papers

[Rivkin]

It definitely sue mihara type of work and it feels like under 1000 that's a great buy. I think old paper is also sue mihara, masaki is submitter's name.

[Franco D]

 

 

It appears that the new caretaker has some homework ahead of him. 

 

https://www.nihontoc.../Mihara_Nihonto.html

 

Good first sword!

 

Regards

[waljamada]

 

Rivkin, 

 

Would be nice if both papers do match and add a bit of weight to them as older papers in my opinion.  It was a real challenge finding potential buys in his price range to be honest.  I couldn't help but notice prices have definitely gone up in general so his options to find something that doesn't need a lot of work was really quite tough and most of his options were blades in very rough shape.  Must say it's hard for a young collector just starting out with college age means.  Then again it makes sense dealers bring their good stuff to a show like this so it's not really geared toward the beginners.  The seller of this blade helped him out and gave him a $200 discount so he could afford it. This blade isn't perfect though, it does have a small area of kizu and most critically the boshi looks to just about run off just as it gets to the tip on one side.  I shared all this with him, what it all means and his other options were so rough, didn't have any papers, were also almost always mumei so he went with this one. I feel like at worst he could get his money back if he ever needed to sell this blade and it has some cool features to enjoy in a pretty solid polish.

 

Franco,

 

Thank you for that resource!  I am putting together some links for him and I will add that link to his homework.

[Franco D]

Study, build a library, when he feels there is nothing more to learn from this sword, then, if he chooses, he can move on.

 

Regards

 

p.s. Although I did not really get to know him well before he died, Allan H. Pressley is where my path to learning nihonto began more than thirty years ago. Chicago was the first show I attended. 

 

 

[SteveM]

NTHK paper attributes it to Den Taira Takada. 

[Rivkin]

BTW, it does look like Oei naginata. Would gladly buy it for 1000 myself. Are they getting that desperate there in Chicago on the first day???

 

P.S. I did not check the new papers, was looking just at old ones. Its hard to be certain by photos, but I like Mihara and don't like Takada attribution. The way masame runs, the hamon width, the fact that jigane stands out but there is not much in the hamon, a lot of things just classic Mihara. Oei Takada looks different, they might have thought its Tensho work, but even then Bungo is suguha tends to be different.

I am too lazy to check, what's the date on papers? If its recent, both NTHK and NTHK NPO declined a lot since 2022 in my opinion.

[PNSSHOGUN]

Small O-Kissaki? Chu Kissaki would be more accurate. 

[waljamada]

Steve M,

Thanks for that!  So we have one for Den Taira Takada and a Sue Mihara, which both also give a general muroumachi era date probably edging towards late muroumachi.

 

Rivkin,

From what I saw the sellers prices in Chicago were actually higher/stronger than last/previous years. In my opinion there was an edge towards a general seller power position in the pricing or the general quality of blades were just higher than previous years.   Probably a bit of both; so I kinda read it all that the market must have strengthened this last year.  I'm really glad this blade was there to give him something in a state that I think will enthuse him to continue learning about and collecting nihonto

 

[waljamada]

12 minutes ago, PNSSHOGUN said:

Small O-Kissaki? Chu Kissaki wouod be more accurate. 

 

It's not a chu kissaki though, proportionally on this 26" nagasa blade it's a longer than average kissaki but it's just not that huge of an o-kissaki.  For example it's kissaki is a good deal longer than the width of the blade.

[SteveM]

NTHK paper is from 1977. It dates the sword to Tenbun (1532-1555).

[Franco D]

7 hours ago, waljamada said:

It's not a chu kissaki though

 

Chu kissaki is sometimes described as being elongated. Based upon the image that appears to be the case here.

 

Regards

[dkirkpatrick]

13 hours ago, waljamada said:

 

Rivkin, 

 

Would be nice if both papers do match and add a bit of weight to them as older papers in my opinion.  It was a real challenge finding potential buys in his price range to be honest.  I couldn't help but notice prices have definitely gone up in general so his options to find something that doesn't need a lot of work was really quite tough and most of his options were blades in very rough shape.  Must say it's hard for a young collector just starting out with college age means.  Then again it makes sense dealers bring their good stuff to a show like this so it's not really geared toward the beginners.  The seller of this blade helped him out and gave him a $200 discount so he could afford it. This blade isn't perfect though, it does have a small area of kizu and most critically the boshi looks to just about run off just as it gets to the tip on one side.  I shared all this with him, what it all means and his other options were so rough, didn't have any papers, were also almost always mumei so he went with this one. I feel like at worst he could get his money back if he ever needed to sell this blade and it has some cool features to enjoy in a pretty solid polish.

 

Franco,

 

Thank you for that resource!  I am putting together some links for him and I will add that link to his homework.

Hard for a young collector?  I bought my first swords back in the late 80s/early 90’s.  Seems like I was paying 300 for wakizashi and 500-600 for katanas, all out of woodwork mind you, not polished/papered.  There was a time when you’d be glad to have something half this good at this price even with major flaws just to study.  So the perception that this sword as presented for 1000$ in 2024 is anything but a fantastic gift just boggles my mind.  

[waljamada]

Dkirkpatrick,

 

I think he did really great as well.  He felt blessed with beaming smiles feeling he got a diamond in the rough at his price point.   If this blade wasn't there he said he thinks he would have left empty handed.

 

PNSShogun and Franco,

 

Thanks for the correction, I had a wrong idea on how far out the chu kissaki scales can go before crossing into o-kissaki.  I'll write down chu kissaki in the description/links I'm putting together for him and his blade.

 

[PNSSHOGUN]

It's really not a big deal but small o-kissaki is like saying a tall midget......

[Franco D]

If possible it would be nice to see closer/better images of the kissaki/boshi and this area of small kizu?

Asking because otherwise this looks like a fairly healthy blade.

 

Thanks.

 

Regards

[Jussi Ekholm]

NTHK states this swords as ubu mumei - 生ぶ無銘 in their paper, so they see it as original length. By first glance it looked like a bit shortened sword to me but it is easy to be wrong when looking at items.

 

You guys did well in finding that deal.

[waljamada]

Jussi,

I wouldn't have thought ubu at all so bit surprised by that one!

 

Franco, 

Here are some pics he sent of the boshi and the kizu areas.  On one side I could see the boshi run to the tip but it's real close, the other side it's too hard to tell when you get close to the tip.  There's a few spots of kitae-ware you'll see below with the worst one that goes along/in the hamon but it looked pretty shallow and from what can be seen doesn't go through to the other side.  So it has issues.

 

[waljamada]

Part 2

 

The top one below of the kitae-ware is the worst of the kizu.