Minatogowa Jinja ??

[wakiboy]

Gentlemen 

A friend has recently acquired a blade signed Yoshihisa with a Seki stamp and dated 1942 it has an engraving of what he thought was a Minatogawa Jinja but the engraving varies at the bottom and I can’t find any info on a Minatogawa smith off that name….

Your opinion would be most appreciated..

Thank you 

Ian

 

 

[lonely panet]

In the wrong place for a shrine sword. And smith names just as big a give away to the seki stamp

[wakiboy]

Hi H

what do you think the reason would be for the engraving when the blade was made in =1942, too early to be a forgery ?

[Brendan campbell]

I looked at this sword last week, i consulted with 2 fellow members and we all concluded Fake . I emailed the auction house to see the tang, my reply , we can’t get the handle off !!! . Strange place for the Mon to be engraved, the orimono on the other side of the blade made no sense and £2k was miles too high to pay. 

[wakiboy]

I agree on all counts but my friend only told me about it after he picked it up, the problem I have is that I don’t understand it being faked while the war was still ongoing.

[rebcannonshooter]

Hi folks, just for clarification, The Kiku-sui mon was a popular symbol in Japan and was not exclusive to the Minatogawa Jinja. Both Gassan Sadakazu and Gassan Sadakatsu engraved this on numerous swords as did other smiths.  It is possible that this was a WW2 engraving, although not of great quality.. 

Tom M.

[Brendan campbell]

Hi Ian, it’s I suppose even during the war , Del Trotter sold swords. To our non UK members Google Delboy. That will explain my theory. 

[wakiboy]

Brendon

I like your theory 😂😂

[PNSSHOGUN]

23rd generation Kanefusa swords can be found with the Kikusui Mon in the same area. As stated before, not necessarily fake - but no relation to the Minatogawa Shrine swords.

[John C]

Ian:

It looks as if there may be some writing or numbers just under the habaki. Are there pictures of that?

John C.

[wakiboy]

Hi John

I asked him for a picture under the Habaki and he said there is nothing except dark greasy marks.

[wakiboy]

Hi John 

I didn’t know that about Kanefusa thanks for the update.

[ROKUJURO]

Brian,

should this not be moved to the military section? This is NIHONTO!

[Bruce Pennington]

Without seeing more of the sword and especially the nakago, it's really not possible to be evaluating this.  I don't have any Yoshihisa on file with stamps, so I'd personally appreciate more photos if you can coach the friend on how to get the tsuka off.

 

For the kikusui, it's the first one I've seen using a single line for the river.  I do have one other blade with the kikusui on the blade.  Unfortunately, I didn't record the source where I found it.

 

 

Interesting that they are both on fullered blades.

[Brendan campbell]

Hi Bruce, here are the main 3 images the auction house had on their website. I hope you can see some more information. 

 

[Bruce Pennington]

Yes, looks interesting.  Something Buddhist on the other side.

[BANGBANGSAN]

On 4/12/2024 at 10:27 PM, Brendan campbell said:

Hi Bruce, here are the main 3 images the auction house had on their website. I hope you can see some more information. 

 

 

 

Do you have the link to this sword?

[BANGBANGSAN]

Besides 湊川神社（Minatogowa Jinja）,四条畷神社(Shijonawate Jinja)in Osaka also uses 菊水紋( Kikusui Mon). Many families also adopt the Kikusui Mon as their crest.
https://irohakamon.c...on/kiku/kikusui.html

 

 

[Brendan campbell]

2 hours ago, BANGBANGSAN said:

Do you have the link to this sword?

Wessex Auction Rooms
Westbrook Farm
Draycot Cerne
Chippenham
Wiltshire
SN15 5LH

Located just off J17 of the M4

Tel

01249 720888

Email

enquiries@wessexauctionrooms.co.uk

[BANGBANGSAN]

4 hours ago, Brendan campbell said:

Wessex Auction Rooms
Westbrook Farm
Draycot Cerne
Chippenham
Wiltshire
SN15 5LH

Located just off J17 of the M4

Tel

01249 720888

Email

enquiries@wessexauctionrooms.co.uk

Brendan

 

Thanks for the info on the auction house. but I can't find that sword, maybe because the auction ended?

[Brendan campbell]

Hi Tristan, the pictures I sent Bruce, were the only pictures available. The description was very basic . A Japanese sword.!!!.

 

[Volker62]

at the Kikusu to above the tang's hole