katana WOII Koshirae

[WellsFargo]

Hello guys,

I'm new to the board and also quite new to "collecting" Japanese swords.

My only genuine Japanese art-sword is a wakizashi with NTHK kanteisho attributed to Aizu Michitoki. To me, it's absolutely beautiful (it can still be seen on the web if you google "aizu michitoki")

But, there was a time I even new less about Japanese swords than I know now and that's when I purchased this Katana which was gathering dust in the corner of a fellow gun-collector's home. To me it looked beautiful and I just had to have it.

I have shown it to mr. Duindam from Token Sugita Europe and he believes it to be a genuine Japanese handcrafted sword but could not give me a whole lot more of info.

A little info on the sword:

- it shows little rust on the tang, indicating to me it's quite young (1900 till 1950 or so?)

- it has no yokote (probably sanded off)

- Mr. Duindam stated it had the shape of an old sword (until he saw the tang and lack of corrosion)

- The hamon is barely visible and seems a little bit brownish in color

- it has "iori mune" (can I say it like that?)

- it has a total length, from tip of the kissaki till end of the tang, of 91 cm.

- it has one mekugi ana

- There is no signature and no stamp to be found on the tang.

[WellsFargo]

So guys, I was wondering if you could give any extra info. Even with these horrible pictures.

I have seen some great looking swords in this section of which you guys state that they are machined.

 

One more question: I thought, "hey, there are file-markings on the tang, then it must be hand-crafted." but is that always the case? If not, why does a machined sword have file markings on the tang? seems "odd" and unnecessary to me. (although I haven't the faintest idea how they "machined" swords)

 

It would be great if you guys could give me some extra info.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Jan-Wouter Thijssen

[Stephen]

Jan

 

never found your wak but heres a mate to it...tease tease

 

http://www.seiyudo.com/KA-098123.htm

[WellsFargo]

Thanks for the tease, Stephen.

Here's some pictures of my wakizashi.

[Stephen]

Very nice

[SwordGuyJoe]

One more question: I thought, "hey, there are file-markings on the tang, then it must be hand-crafted." but is that always the case? If not, why does a machined sword have file markings on the tang? seems "odd" and unnecessary to me. (although I haven't the faintest idea how they "machined" swords)

 

Even machine made showato will have yasurime. I have a concern about your katana. In the posted pic of the nakago, you can see what appears to be a crack. Perhaps its a bad pic. Also - and this may be attributable to a bad photo - but the kissaki isn't well formed/non-existent. Better pictures may sway a person, but first pass, this looks to be showato.

 

Edit: I neglected to re-post the photo

[WellsFargo]

Hi Joe,

 

You have good eyes. That is in fact a crack/groove in the tang.

 

And yes, the kissaki doesn't look too good. Edit: about one milimeter of the tip has broken off. That is probably what you mean? The blade has been sanded in certain places which is clearly visible. Near the habaki the blade still shows a little hamon, but after that it's gone. Covered by sanding markings.

 

Okay, so you lean towards showato. But.... (here I come again) Does a machined sword show blisters? Or can this happen only with "layered" swords? It has one small blister in the middle of the blade.

 

Thanks for your opinion, by the way.

 

Jan-Wouter

[SwordGuyJoe]

Showato does not necessarily mean machine made. It means not traditionally made. Some would say this is just the forging process and not materials, but some would say it extends through the forging process and all the way to the raw material. Meaning that a gendai blade could be crafted from non-tamahagane steel. Also, most WWII smiths were at least assisted by machines and most did not use tamahagane. So depending on the definition of "Traditional" most WWII swords are showato, not gendaito (even the Yasukuni smiths did use strictly tamahagane in their swords).

 

When I speak to your sword, I say that I believe it's showato, I am not speaking to whether it was touched by a machine - although I would assume it was. I believe your blade was partially handmade, quenched in oil - not water. This reduced the amount of rejected blades, as the water quenching cause a radical decrease in temp and cracks blades far easier than oil.

 

When I talk about your kissaki, I am saying that it is not formed well - although the tip missing is a much bigger problem - meaning, there is not a well defined yokote. This indicates - in my opinion at least - that the blade was not given much attention in the polishing process, leading me to the fact that it wasn't worth dedicating the time to (i.e. Showato, not a traditionally forged Gendaito).

 

Please be sure to read the assumptions above and also that this is my opinion alone and I ask that you interpret it as such. To truly understand the quality of a blade a person needs to examine it in hand.

[WellsFargo]

Thanks for your info, Joe. It's very much appreciated.

 

Greets,

 

J.W.

[johntorress]

in other words....they only trick you....that is a pirated katana. did you happen to return it back from where you purchase it?

[David Flynn]

Just a note for reference. I noticed when I was in Japan, that they generaly class Gendaito as post war. Hand made blades before and including the war, they class as Showato and Oil tempered etc, they class as gunto.

I discovered this to my ire, as I'm principly a Gendai(Showa) collector.

[WellsFargo]

Mr. Torres,

 

I do not know exactly what you mean with a "pirated sword" but I can imagine.

 

As a matter of fact, I can blame no one but myself for this purchase. It was purchased from a fellow guncollector who admittedly had no interest in, nor knowledge of this sword or Nihonto.

 

Further more this sword was of course not expensive.

 

I will most definately keep it for sentimental value and to remind me to be careful of emotional purchases.

 

It is what it is..... a sword made for war but not true Nihonto.

 

Greets,

 

J.W.

[Bruno]

Further more this sword was of course not expensive.

 

I will most definately keep it for sentimental value and to remind me to be careful of emotional purchases.

 

Agreed with you J.W. If you did not pay "too much" for it and if the koshirae is nice looking(if there is a koshirae), it is not that a bad purchase.Yes the crack on the nakago is disturbing, but are we sure it is a fatal deep crack? difficult to tell only with the pics.

 

Sentimental value is as important as pecuniary value for me too.

 

Yes, not a master piece, probably a standard showato with defects I guess many of us have had or still have this kind of sword in their collection.I do! :D