Royal Mail (UK) banning all bladed items from 22nd April 2024

[Brian]

Funny thing is there wasn't any issue with youngsters abusing weapons or using them for crime. I wonder what changed? (sarcastic)
Must be the fault of the weapons, right. They got more dangerous? Spears and knives and swords developed evil spirits? Or maybe discipline and respect morphed into social media and mental issues.
Remember when US kids had a rifle in their truck when they went to school to hunt rabbits after school. That change in upbringing and disciple methods are sue paying off now. Such huge progress. (again, sarcasm)
Anyways, not to get off topic, I remember getting my CZ75 9mmP pistol when I turned 18. Dad was convinced it was going to stay in his safe until I was older. Never left my own safe though, never had a problem with it, and never even considered it anything than a dangerous tool that needed respect.
Kudos to those that train their kids from a young age in the safety and handling of weapons. Those kids seem to grow up different.
Now you go to prison for having a WW1 trench knuckle knife, because all the gangster like to carry a 110 year old weapon, right?
 

[Alex A]

My last comment on this subject.

 

Speculating about the future of collecting within the UK on a public forum may do as much damage as the original subject.

 

If not more................

 

Seriously, gone from Royal asshole post stopping delivering edged steel to the land of doom and gloom.

 

No one has mentioned looking for alternatives, just gone on about the "good old days"

 

Depressing thread, we are all doomed if this is the response of the collecting community.

 

Be nice read something positive

 

No offence to anyone,

[Alex A]

Forgot say, about Arms fairs.

 

What's different about these days and lets say the 70s?....................................The Internet.

 

Don't know about anywhere else, but in the UK a lot of the high streets that used to be busy with shoppers are DEAD. The retailers have left, vacant buildings now being turned into flats or left to be derelict.

 

Point being, people prefer to look online than travel into some busy city where perhaps they get hit with travel charges?. You have to take a car, you cant get on the train with a sword.

 

There are ,more Westerners interested in owning Japanese swords now than in the 70s, thanks to the Internet.

 

Are Arms fairs the best place to buy Japanese swords?, NO, though some might think otherwise.

 

Usually don't have papers and are in old polish. Fittings often worn with rattling tsuba and tsuka falling to pieces, for the most part, projects. 

 

Sometimes you may come across an out of polish sword with a relatively well known mei, who can make a call on the spot whether gimei or not on a random sword that you just come across?

 

Even Katana that seem relatively cheap are never cheap. 

 

There are easier and more convenient ways to buy Japanese swords, that involves sitting on your ass and looking at a screen and asking folks on a forum is what im looking at legit? or just buying a sword from a well known dealer on the internet, with papers.

 

Times have changed, this has all been said before.

 

What i find about Arms fairs, the only time you ever find anything interesting is when your not looking for it..

 

Preston Arms fair, you cant find a parking spot, its easily accessible for folks in the NW. Saying that though, its tough times for a lot of folks financially at the moment, hence everyone wants a bargain.

 

 

 

 

 

[pcfarrar]

 

[Davis]

Thanks Colin, appreciate you comments, Lewis and Russ, nice to know you remember those times. Alex, I was going to try and reply with something positive and mention the good work that was done in 2007 when they were trying an outright ban.  I spent much time writing to MP's and Home Office etc.,  It was others though who managed to save the situation.  See this page from the Consultation Document.  I just broke off for a cup of tea and saw a news item on TV,  an incident is in progress at Hainault tube station ( I knew it well ).  A man has gone berserk with a sword and stabbed five people.  The shape of the sword is familiar.  Seeing that, my attempts at being positive have evaporated.  I don't recognize my country anymore, the sacrifices by my parents and grandparent's and those generations, were in vain.

Consultation document.pdf

[Alex A]

Aye, seen that on the news.

 

Last thing we need.

[Alex A]

Had a reply, 

 

Thank you for your email.

Royal Mail Group (including Parcelforce) has recently undertaken a thorough evaluation of bladed items that have been allowed through our age verification service. This evaluation was undertaken with a primary focus on mitigating the risk of bladed items falling into the wrong hands. Our commitment to public safety and that of our dedicated delivery personnel has led us to introduce changes to our restrictions on bladed items, as outlined in our prohibitions and restrictions list here: Account prohibitions and restrictions | Parcelforce Worldwide

 

These changes will come into effect on the 7th May 2024. Please be aware that any shipments containing the newly prohibited items must cease by this date.

 

While we acknowledge that these adjustments may present some inconvenience, we are steadfast in our commitment to enhancing public safety. Your cooperation in adhering to these new measures is greatly appreciated as we strive to positively contribute to the well-being of our communities.

 

Regards,

Account Management Team

 

 

[Alex A]

The attached link

Account prohibitions and restrictions | Parcelforce Worldwide

 

 

 

 

"Art" appears to be an exception,  

 

 

Sharp objects and instruments (which are not classified as prohibited goods)

These items  may only be despatched if they are packaged appropriately so that they do not present a risk to staff, other packages or recipients.

Works of art

Works of art exceeding a value of EUR 750.00 cannot be exported using the europriority service and some destinations on the euroeconomy† service.

For further information refer to parcelforce.com. Works of art can be sent using the globalexpress service, but are excluded from compensation for loss or damage.

† Restrictions apply to countries delivered through GLS on euroeconomy. These are: Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Estonia, Finland, Germany, Hungary, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Monaco, Netherlands, Poland, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia.

 

[Alex A]

ps, what a reversal, after what they did to all those folks, throwing them in prison and what not,.

 

we strive to positively contribute to the well-being of our communities.

 

[Abaris]

I do not see Spain on that restriction list 

[Alex A]

Just to add.

 

Even before this latest episode with Parcelfarce, would have tried to avoid using them anyways.

 

There are better couriers.

 

Maybe look at using UPS, they have their own customs and avoid the dreaded Coventry hub (at risk of sounding like a broken record)

 

Last sword arrived with Fedex

 

Sod Parcelfarce.

[Abaris]

What about DHL?

[Ynot]

https://www.shooting...o-ban-blades-147754/

 

Never underestimate the gun lobby!

[Alex A]

Hope that's the case.

 

Maybe they have realized that their mission to clear their muddy name, coming up with such lines as...........

 

"we strive to positively contribute to the well-being of our communities"

 

Actually wont achieve their goal. and do more damage to their reputation.

 

Besides, sure their will be another courier (maybe lower tier courier) just waiting to take advantage, like a coiled spring.

[Alex A]

Seriously, when you think about it, its beyond belief.

 

Their job is solely to deliver a "LEGAL TO OWN" item from one place to another.

 

As other couriers do.

[Gakusee]

Two points we need to consider:

 

1) swords are still “prohibited”

(to be sent); 

2) while the ban is clear as regards “sending”, it will be useful to understand if “receiving” in their Parcelforce clearance depot will be permitted. That is only pertinent for receiving swords from overseas and in case Parcelforce needs to do the customs clearance (which it usually does and processes import levies). If that is permitted, one can drive to the depot and collect the imported sword. But it needs to be verified. 

[Alex A]

Would forget them and look for alternatives.

 

Another mail, after i replied to their robot reproduced mail that they sent around the country to others.

 

I wont be risking importing anything that finishes its journey with them, can see it heading back to sender. I guess its up to folks if they want to go collecting from the hub, rather than another firm delivering to the door.

 

 

Please accept my apologies for any inconvenience this is going to caused you .  

 

I am really sorry about this statement but all customer had to receive the same  and I do hope this has help you understand why we are no longer carrying these bladed items . It is decision that has been made by Royal Mail Group (including Parcelforce) and unfortunately it will not be changed.

 

Once again, please accept my apologies

 

[The Blacksmith]

In the interesting post by Ynot, it states at the bottom, Royal Mail will now continue to carry “any knife or knife blade, including cutlery knives, bread knives, knives that can be used for hobbies and trades, butcher knives (including meat cleavers), felling axes and razor blades” 

Isn't collecting classified as a hobby?

 

I have just had two bayonets sent to me today from the UK, which have been  collected by Royal Mail and is in the system, we will see what happens...........

[Alex A]

Russ, its vague, i was hoping the "art" might swing it for us too.

 

Meanwhile, Arms and armour society Zoom meeting last night and the topic was brought up.

 

Briefly, a gent that sends modern replicas around the world stated he has used the following, mentioning they all have their own customs clearance.

 

UPS (apparently, now forms to fill in, used them for antique guns, they did have their own clearance)

FEDEX (last sword arrived with this courier, they were very good, had their own clearance)

DHL (Though length restrictions, cant remember using)

 

As a Society, they are looking into further action, that needs time. They are also looking for new members, would urge folks to consider, as going forward with collecting in the UK, it may be wise. Especially those that collect an array of varying antique arms, not just the Japanese swords.

 

Contacted Aoi Art this morn to get their take on the situation and see if they can come up with alternatives that don't complete with Parcelforce.

 

 

[Samurai Art]

This might be helpful as I bought a sword from the USA in January.
 

With FedEx, they accepted the sword for shipment to the UK (under my account). However, upon arrival in the UK, FedEx UK rejected it and sent it back.
 

As a DHL account holder, I attempted to use their services, but DHL UK refused to transport swords within the UK.
 

Turning to UPS, they reached out to me to confirm if the sword exceeded 50cm in length and if it was curved. I ensured they understood it was a regulated weapon and met all legal importation criteria. So UPS won and I received my sword.

It's regrettable that the UK poses the main obstacle. Border Force, operating through Parcelforce, can be inconsistent in their scrutiny, sometimes choosing to hassle the importer with certain shipments. Currently, UPS stands out as the sole independent logistics option willing to both ship and clear items under its own logistics operation.

[Abaris]

So my question is, would be possible to import a blade if I'm the one carrying it (I mean, regular travel then I deliver the item to the f.e. sirayashi)? 

[Samurai Art]

I know several individuals who have successfully transported swords as part of their luggage.

 

Personally, I encountered issues with ANA at both Heathrow and Haneda airports when I disclosed that I was carrying a sword as sporting equipment. To circumvent this, I claimed the tube contained "budogu," describing it as kendo equipment, and it passed through oversized luggage without any hiccups. Notably, it was the airline check-in staff who proved difficult, not Customs, who seemed indifferent to the sword bag slung over my shoulder.
 

This year, a fellow dealer has transported antique nihonto through Narita without incident, which is good news. Additionally, I'm aware of someone (UK) who is collaborating with the same Japanese dealer to serve as a sword courier between the UK and Japan this year, they are just looking into insurance to cover the transit. Once operational, I plan to encourage this individual to publicly announce the service. I feel this would be beneficial to UK Collectors, including the Token groups to use this person. Once in Japan with the said dealer, the swords can be submitted for shinsa or have any restoration carried out before return. Also, those buying swords would have someone to act as an agent.

 

[Lewis B]

16 minutes ago, MIFUNE said:

This year, a fellow dealer has transported antique nihonto through Narita without incident, which is good news. Additionally, I'm aware of someone (UK) who is collaborating with the same Japanese dealer to serve as a sword courier between the UK and Japan this year, they are just looking into insurance to cover the transit. Once operational, I plan to encourage this individual to publicly announce the service. I feel this would be beneficial to UK Collectors, including the Token groups to use this person. Once in Japan with the said dealer, the swords can be submitted for shinsa or have any restoration carried out before return. Also, those buying swords would have someone to act as an agent.

 

I think I know who you're talking about and that would be an excellent option, especially when sending blades to Japan for Shinsa. I hope he makes an official announcement.

[Alex A]

4 hours ago, MIFUNE said:

This might be helpful as I bought a sword from the USA in January.
 

With FedEx, they accepted the sword for shipment to the UK (under my account). However, upon arrival in the UK, FedEx UK rejected it and sent it back.
 

As a DHL account holder, I attempted to use their services, but DHL UK refused to transport swords within the UK.
 

Turning to UPS, they reached out to me to confirm if the sword exceeded 50cm in length and if it was curved. I ensured they understood it was a regulated weapon and met all legal importation criteria. So UPS won and I received my sword.

It's regrettable that the UK poses the main obstacle. Border Force, operating through Parcelforce, can be inconsistent in their scrutiny, sometimes choosing to hassle the importer with certain shipments. Currently, UPS stands out as the sole independent logistics option willing to both ship and clear items under its own logistics operation.

 

Been said before, but think sometimes its a case of who is on duty. With regards FedEx, i thought they did a great job, accurate tracking all the way. All very hit and miss.

 

Never been a fan of stuff coming into the country with Parcelforce, due to miscalculated customs fees and them holding stuff at Coventry.  Shipping out with them was never an issue.

 

Regarding UPS, they seem experienced at dealing with such items, sending the importer the forms to fill in. All seemed very proper the times i have dealt with them, even paying the import duty whilst the item was still in the original country. Hoping they will continue to do so.

 

Had a reply from Aoi.  I don't think they yet have a grasp of the potential issues that may arise. They just said they deal with EMS which they know ends with Parcelforce.  They say they cant ship via FedEx and as they did not mention UPS, then i take it that likely is not an option there either.

 

Who knows, perhaps Parcelforce will still continue to ship the few antique swords that come in every so often, perhaps not. Time will tell.  Perhaps as Michael pointed out, one could collect it from UK customs.

 

 

[Gakusee]

ANA and Haneda = trouble and delays in most cases. Inexperienced airport staff and disallowed /prohibited to carry on board by airline. 

JAL/BA (they operate shared codes and flights) and Narita = OK in most cases (almost always). 

 

In almost all cases, if you can ensure an individual transports the items for you, go for that method. Unlimited number of blades allowed on the way out of Japan for export but max 3 on the way into Japan when bringing in.

Watch out for value of items, declare them as weapons, be mindful gold is taxable on the way in  etc etc etc 

 

In short, just deal with an experienced and professional importer. There are several dealers in the U.K. who do this professionally. 

[Alex A]

If anyone ordering from Japan, probably best to make them aware of the situation.

 

A reply from Aoi. Hopefully the swords they send via EMS will continue to be received here, we will find out. Mentioned that to them and maybe if there are issues then receivers could pick up from Customs.

 

In the meantime, they are looking into using UPS.........................

 

 

 

Thank you for your reply.

We sent swords to the UK two times by EMS this February and they arrived safely. Do you know when did the system change?

We think it is possible to send a sword by UPS, but we have never used it to the UK.

 

Kind regards

Aoi Art

 

 

 

ps, in a further email they state.....................

 

"we have sent swords to other European countries by UPS."

 

"we hope they recognize it as work of art" 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lee Bray]

22 hours ago, Lewis B said:

I think I know who you're talking about and that would be an excellent option, especially when sending blades to Japan for Shinsa. I hope he makes an official announcement.

I've done this a couple of times from HK to Narita and the maximum allowance is three swords per person, so worth bearing in mind.

[Matsunoki]

One of today’s headlines. I despair. Will it solve anything…….? No need to answer. I just hope all of collectors societies start talking now because we are heading for a Labour Govt.

[Brian]

Yip. As expected. It was the sword that killed him. Not the person. Just like spoons make people fat.
You guys in the UK are in so much trouble. My sympathies.
 

[The Blacksmith]

Many years back, I lost my, legally held, pistol as a result of some nutter going into a school and shooting people with a pistol. Result: All pistols banned in the UK!  Had he gone in throwing Molotov cocktails instead of using a gun, would they have banned cars I wonder? I very seriously doubt it!

 

I have heard that the two bayonets that I have ordered have now left the UK, so that is good. However, I am after a No.4 'spike' bayonet also from a dealer in the UK. The bayonet is only £39, but wonder what UPS or DHL would want to ship such a small item? Far too much to be worthwhile I would imagine. Also, we have to pay customs on the carriage too as well as the item!