Is this a keeper?

[Avidmark]

Hey folks, I’m new to the forums but I’ve been deep diving for the last few weeks. Been reading books a lot and spending a good amount of time googling questions I have which always lead me to this great forum. I’ve been looking a quite a few blades that fit my modest budget. In doing research I always seem to come back to one particular blade. And I’m wondering if it’s worth jumping on. 
I’m not looking to make it an investment, and I don’t plan on collecting more than one blade. It doesn’t have to be a masterpiece, just something worth owning and preserving, and to admire when cleaning. Here is the blade in question. It ticks many boxes for me. 
Budget, trusted dealer, papered, condition, time period, blade signature, not shortened. 

https://www.aoijapan.com/katana-shinano-kami-fujiwara-nobuyoshithe-2ndnbthk-tokubetsu-hozon-token/?_sft_category=katana&_sfm_era=古刀(平安〜文永)-,-新刀(慶長〜宝暦)-,-新々刀(明和〜明治)&_sfm_paper=特別保存刀剣&_sfm_price=100000+800000

 

Not looking for members to tell me to buy or not, just wondering if this is a good fit for a good quality first and potentially only blade. 
thanks for your input. 

[Bugyotsuji]

Mark, you remind me of the guy who said, "Hey, I'm just going to try one shot of this heroin stuff, just the one!"

 

My reply would be, "What is so great about this particular heroin that it will satisfy you forever?"

[Avidmark]

Ha! That’s a good one. I’ve said the same about watches. However I’ve only got space for one blade to display (as per my wife). 

[Bugyotsuji]

Magically, that rule will get ... uhhhh... adjusted over the months and years. 

 

I can hear your wife asking you, "Is that the same one?" 

 

And you, "Yes, I've had that for years!" (Never mind that it is longer, and in a regular koshirae...)

 

PS I have a sword stand to sell you. OK if it's got space for three blades? 

[Bugyotsuji]

Seriously though, a blade can tick all the right boxes, like buying a Honda Civic with all the warranties and service history, owned by one old lady.

And you'll be happy with it, and learn stuff from it. 

 

Then you show it to your best buddy and he mentions he has just bought a Mazda Roadster Mustang Ferrari.

 

As someone said today on another thread, and I agree, I find that I learn best when I can get my hands on one object for a while. This is followed by a period of ambivalence as people insert their various opinions.... , and then it's: have I learned enough from it, do I let go of it or not, etc.?

[Avidmark]

With all that being said, is this a good blade to start with? Too much?

[David Flynn]

You could do a lot worse.

[Guest Simon R]

"Is this a keeper?"

 

Your heart tells you that, not us.

[Franco D]

Suggest writing out all of the pluses and minuses that you see in this sword, and if you don't know or aren't certain try asking.

Then decide for yourself.

 

Keeper? One should always be prepared that a sword will not find a new owner. 

 

 

Regards,

 

[Rivkin]

Its not bad and has a number of positives about it.

[Shugyosha]

6 hours ago, Avidmark said:

Ha! That’s a good one. I’ve said the same about watches. However I’ve only got space for one blade to display (as per my wife). 

 

Hi Mark,

You have your wife on display?

 

It's a perfectly healthy blade in terms of not being shortened or overly polished, it's in good condition and has higher papers and the only detractors that I can see are some slight scuff marks. I'd ask Aoi if it comes with a shirasaya as that information is absent from the blurb - it almost certainly will but you need something to keep it in so I'd ask the question.

 

The only thing I would think about is whether, for a display piece, a sword with koshirae might suit you better but that's for you to decide.

 

You could do a heck of a lot worse (and many of us have).

[Grevedk]

Hi Mark,

 

I am still a very recent collector in the Nihonto field and as such to be considered a “rookie” in the true sense of the word. But - when we are talking about Nihonto as a field of study you probably will be a “rookie” for many years to come because of the sheer amount of knowledge there is to be gained. It never really ends.

 

The sword that you are looking at is from my perspective a good fit in regard to price (600.000,- JPY < 4500$) versus papers, attribution and the sword by itself. I believe it would be a good first investment. But - as Piers noted - it’s probably also going to be the first of several swords (as you will be hooked). I only wanted one sword to begin with - today I find my self in possession of several blades (katana, wakizashi and tanto) 😜

 

Looking forward to see your first choice 😎👍

 

All the best.

 

/Soren 

[Nihonto student]

Dear Mark,

 

in my humble opinion I agree with the previous posts... the blade has a series of positive elements (Ubu, signed, very healty with TH paper) also compared to the price at which it is offered therefore I think it can perfectly perform the "function" of display, as John said perhaps a koshirae would be more appropriate to complete the package.
I wonder if there is a particular reason that pushes you to consider a Shinto blade as your first purchase (There could be many, just my curiosity).

 

Regards,

Giordy

[Bugyotsuji]

And there you have it, all the thoughts that should already be inside your own head! 

 

Oh, and I hope you checked the wording and saw that it does mention shirasaya, and wondered why it is ranked a 'Chujo saku' when that is not in their list, and why they call it a 'wakizashi' (even in the original Japanese) at one point when it's not. 

[Shugyosha]

42 minutes ago, Bugyotsuji said:

Oh, and I hope you checked the wording and saw that it does mention shirasaya.

 

Duh, sorry overlooked that.

[Avidmark]

7 hours ago, Nihonto student said:

Dear Mark,

 

in my humble opinion I agree with the previous posts... the blade has a series of positive elements (Ubu, signed, very healty with TH paper) also compared to the price at which it is offered therefore I think it can perfectly perform the "function" of display, as John said perhaps a koshirae would be more appropriate to complete the package.
I wonder if there is a particular reason that pushes you to consider a Shinto blade as your first purchase (There could be many, just my curiosity).

 

Regards,

Giordy

Going for Shinto blades because everywhere I’ve looked (10 pages of classifieds here, and 6 recommended dealer websites) Koto blades are out of my budget. $5000 usd. 

[Avidmark]

I mistakenly overlooked this piece. It’s the absolute top end of my budget. 
I actually prefer the blade details of this however it has been cut many times. 
 

https://www.aoijapan...kubetsu-hozon-token/

 

It’s better to spend the money on the blade and forge quality over getting hung up on originality and signature, correct?

[Rivkin]

37 minutes ago, Avidmark said:

Going for Shinto blades because everywhere I’ve looked (10 pages of classifieds here, and 6 recommended dealer websites) Koto blades are out of my budget. $5000 usd. 

 

You can get first rate mumei Muromachi daito for this price. Signed pieces, yes there are probably will be significant demerits involved.

Shinto is easier to appreciate though.

[Rivkin]

17 minutes ago, Avidmark said:

I mistakenly overlooked this piece. It’s the absolute top end of my budget. 
I actually prefer the blade details of this however it has been cut many times. 
 

https://www.aoijapan...kubetsu-hozon-token/

 

It’s better to spend the money on the blade and forge quality over getting hung up on originality and signature, correct?

 

Very good hamon, very coarse jigane.

[Bugyotsuji]

And there you have it, the dilemma of the sword collector. Whatever you choose will never be perfect, and there'll be something even better just out of reach...

 

It is worth remembering however, that some of the most famous Japanese swords had a flaw. The Sanchomo (Yamatorige) for example has a bloody great chip missing from the blade. And hey, even the Liberty Bell has a crack in it, and they've even drilled it out to make it easier for Joe Public to see!.

[Avidmark]

25 minutes ago, Bugyotsuji said:

And there you have it, the dilemma of the sword collector. Whatever you choose will never be perfect, and there'll be something even better just out of reach...

 

It is worth remembering however, that some of the most famous Japanese swords had a flaw. The Sanchomo (Yamatorige) for example has a bloody great chip missing from the blade. And hey, even the Liberty Bell has a crack in it, and they've even drilled it out to make it easier for Joe Public to see!.

Wise statement. Can definitely identify with that. 

[Kanenaga]

I would ask the seller, who is well known on this board, to confirm that the dark streaks in the hamon are indeed "streaks" of oil or dirt or whatever, and not lamination openings, which if present would not necessarily disqualify the sword but might interfere with your enjoyment of it.

[Rivkin]

There are quite a few long ware here some of which clearly touch hamon's upper portion. I think light from a side significantly exaggerates how deep those are compared to angled image.

The rounded darkening I would hope is hand caused.

[Avidmark]

12 hours ago, Kanenaga said:

I would ask the seller, who is well known on this board, to confirm that the dark streaks in the hamon are indeed "streaks" of oil or dirt or whatever, and not lamination openings, which if present would not necessarily disqualify the sword but might interfere with your enjoyment of it.

[Avidmark]

Are these the the areas of concern?

[Kanenaga]

There is also a large one on the other side, lower down toward the nakago.

[Avidmark]

56 minutes ago, Kanenaga said:

There is also a large one on the other side, lower down toward the nakago.

I reached out to them to ask about it.  May take a while to hear back. I’m an infant at all this but all three seem very straight. Delamination is usually a bit grainy and jagged, no?

[French nihonto]

1 hour ago, Kanenaga said:

 

There is also a large one on the other side, lower down toward the nakago.

 

I've already had this kind of mark on one of my old blades. It's hard to tell from the photos if it's exactly the same on this blade.  But sometimes the Shirasaya is a bit too tight and causes blackish rub marks. 

[Avidmark]

Aoi’s response:

 

“We checked the part you inquired about.

We guess the two "streaks" are the rust. It will be clear by polishing more.“

 

I suppose black rust which based on reading is ok? 
Was also reading this may come off in time with regular appropriate cleaning with uchiko and oil. 

[Stephen]

Black page for me