Unusual Leather Covered Saya

[Guest Simon R]

On Mercari at present there is a rather unusual non military saya which has been adapted for wartime use.

It's obviously a special order as it retains the original kurigata but has two loops allowing it to be slung over the officer's shoulders. The chape is also an unusual configuration (almost like it's been cut with pinking shears). 

 

More pictures to follow.
 

 

[Guest Simon R]

[Michaelr]

Very interesting. It should be an interesting discussion on this one. Thank you for sharing   

  MikeR

[Scogg]

In Dawson's Cyclopedia of military swords in the civilian guntos section, he talks about the leather covers. I just read the section last night (i'm at work right now, or i'd use a direct quote. anyone have the book handy?)

Some swords were given leather covers over their preexisting older Saya. So if one of those saya was missing an ashi, sometime they would be added under the cover.

Maybe this is a custom, or late war "quickie". Using leather ashi instead of the metal ones to save time/money

Just a theory,
***Edit: to add the  photo of leather ashi from Jim Dawsons book, page 170 

-Sam

Edited January 25, 2024 by GeorgeLuucas
Added photo

[Bruce Pennington]

There is a larger conversation about the straps that allow the sword to be carried across the back. I haven’t been able to find it, but maybe one of our gifted gurus with search engines can pull it up for us.

 

I think @BANGBANGSAN owns one, or it has a bunch of pictures of them and use.

[Bruce Pennington]

There are a few examples of this, with photos, on the forum.  This is the only one I could find, but my Search skills are really bad.  Seems like @BANGBANGSAN owns one, or has the photos. 

 

 

[Kiipu]

It was rather difficult to find but below is the thread.

Leather hanger for Type 95 Cavalry 騎兵用?

[Bruce Pennington]

Bingo!  That's the one!

 

There are other WWII photos, too.  We'll find them eventually!

[Guest Simon R]

Many thanks gentlemen!

 

Hi Sam @GeorgeLuucas,

I believe the leather loops are a choice rather than a late war compromise. If you think about it, leather on top of leather does not hurt the lacquer which I presume lies beneath the cover. The typical brass oval with round hanger, however, was always forced up the wooden inner saya before the leather cover was applied - therefore it would scratch the hell off any antique urushi coating. The owner obviously cared about retaining the original old saya because the kurigata is still in situ - on many examples it has simply been knocked off to facilitate easier application of the leather outer.

[Scogg]

That makes a ton of sense. Thank you! 
 

I see on some of the other examples in the other thread, the leather rings are attached a certain distance apart.
 

On yours, does the ring toward the kissaki slide independently up and down the saya? Or are they stitched in place? 

[Tensho]

Looks like the hanger has been slid down. 

[BANGBANGSAN]

Scabbard strap

 

 

[Tensho]

I'm still skeptical this was ever intended to be mounted as such. You see leather double hanger saya show up on Army Gunto from time to time(a lot on Kai gunto). More so now from Japanese sellers selling gunto koshirae that are in almost mint condition. 

 

The dark "shadow" from the original position is clear evidence that it wasn't lower. You can also see a gap in the hanger. If this was slung on the back there would be nothing to keep the hanger from sliding up on you.  I'd imagine it'd be a real PITA to remove. Having one stitched in place or unable to slide makes more sense. 

[DTM72]

Just be careful, there ARE replicas of this out there.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/266206030875?hash=item3dfb1dac1b:g:5dcAAOSwE~Vj6Fsm&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4KDrqMrr6umQUc%2BOmAili8Dyoe%2BrBFOqWH%2FDKlauPknYt1EBlwHUd2t6%2Fai%2BUFfOZpMx6INQFGf3jKq1pMVru21lSz%2BGF9CDjXmZ8fV6ejBY7osTWEF9uxUSi8ZSwkFaz76hN1XTAOd8ZY%2B7NTBW4o1Iv088Uq2SHEFW%2BNg3UbU%2FNyGE9G8iTUVdig%2BzSKreoOOsURNAchG1FBDqwk%2F4Snvv4563DPqhlYhT%2BBEPujDWxEQ5h%2FY2UdQKdEACSAQH7z6KfXWt0KYaPK6yzXzB%2F4ANqECxtrW8nyfh2M4KQevo|tkp%3ABk9SR8T4xo2sYw