Nanbokucho Chiyozuru Katana NBTHK hozon bare blade need advice

[Lexvdjagt]

Hello NMB,

 

I recently acquired this Chiyozuru katana from a local here in the Netherlands. It came like this, with no shirasaya, or any koshirae. Only the blade and a habaki clearly not made for the blade. The condition of the blade is fantastic, I have photographed all the imperfections I could find. The blade seems to have been expertly polished a while back. The NBTHK papers noted  Mike Yamasaki on the back, as did another label. My guess for the age of the blade is about Late nanbokucho to early muromachi. As most general Chiyozuru swords are attributed to this era. 

 

I initially wanted to get a shirasaya for this katana as soon as possible, there was a restorer in the Netherlands who offered such services. But the shirasaya would not be made from the traditional wood used in all Japanese shirasaya. I am still learning about nihonto, and am extremely cautious not to damage the blade. I want the best for the blade. I was wondering what the best course of action would be? I am considering selling the blade here on NMB to a buyer in the US or elsewhere that would be able to properly maintain it. Any advice on what to do would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Lexvdjagt]

[Lexvdjagt]

[PNSSHOGUN]

How on earth did a papered, polished, Nanbokucho sword not come with shirasaya or any mounts? One would suspect the original mounts were cynically, and unceremoniously, flogged off for a quick buck.

[Lexvdjagt]

@PNSSHOGUN, I must say I was as puzzled as you. I asked the seller how it was sold to him. And he told me the antique dealer had the sword like this (without habaki even). The antique dealer he bought it from wanted to sell a few papered swords for quick cash. That was years ago. I think the antique dealer sold the mounts of the blade.

[Mark S.]

Here is a tutorial on making a paper Saya from a very trusted member of the community.  Should at least protect blade from damage, if you are careful, until you can figure out next steps.
 

 

[Guest Simon R]

OUCH! Is that a floor the kissaki is resting on? If so, you're not doing the blade any favours before having it remounted in shirasaya.

[Lexvdjagt]

3 hours ago, Mark S. said:

Here is a tutorial on making a paper Saya from a very trusted member of the community.  Should at least protect blade from damage, if you are careful, until you can figure out next steps.
 

 

Thank you for the video, I have done as instructed and constructed a paper saya. Thank you!

 

 

16 minutes ago, Simon R said:

OUCH! Is that a floor the kissaki is resting on? If so, you're not doing the blade any favours before having it remounted in shirasaya.

Hello Simon R,

The blade is not touching my table. It is in the air, I would never let the blade touch any surface without laying it on something like the sword bag I laid it on. The perspective of the picture makes it seem so.

 

Greetings,

Lex van der Jagt

 

[Lexvdjagt]

I am still a bit puzzled about what to do with the sword, the paper saya is of course only temporary. It should be held in a proper shirasaya, but I haven't found any location here in the EU that could provide me with a traditionally made shirasaya. That is why I am considering selling the sword. Any help with the value of the blade would also be greatly appreciated. I want the sword to be preserved in the best way, and I am afraid I do not have the facilities to do so here.

 

 

[Grey Doffin]

If you sell the sword and have to ship it to the new owner: how to safely ship a bare blade.

You need a stout tube, about 5 or so cm longer than the blade, end caps for the tube, and a piece of 1/8" masonite (or similar) that fits snugly, both top to bottom and side to side, in the tube. With the blade in its paper shirasaya, lay it on the masonite and mark the mekigi-ana on the masonite. Mark another hole just above the nakago next to the 1st mark. Drill holes in the masonite at the marks. Tie a sturdy piece of insulated electric wire through the holes in the masonite and blade to secure it to the masonite, or you can use a nylon zip tie. Securely tape the blade in paper saya to the masonite in 3 or so spots along its length. Insert into the tube, place the end caps, and you're set.

Grey

[Lexvdjagt]

 

10 minutes ago, Grey Doffin said:

If you sell the sword and have to ship it to the new owner: how to safely ship a bare blade.

You need a stout tube, about 5 or so cm longer than the blade, end caps for the tube, and a piece of 1/8" masonite (or similar) that fits snugly, both top to bottom and side to side, in the tube. With the blade in its paper shirasaya, lay it on the masonite and mark the mekigi-ana on the masonite. Drill a hole in the masonite at the mark. Tie a sturdy piece of insulated electric wire through the holes in the masonite and blade or you can use a nylon zip tie. Securely tape the blade in paper saya to the masonite in 3 or so spots along its length. Insert into the tube, place the end caps, and you're set.

Grey

Hello Grey,

Thank you so much for this advice, I will make sure to follow it closely.

[Jussi Ekholm]

In the UK, Mike Hickman Smith. I haven't have personally any work done by him but I know he does great stuff. Our UK members will know more about him and could pass you the contact info.

[Guest Simon R]

10 hours ago, Lexvdjagt said:

Thank you for the video, I have done as instructed and constructed a paper saya. Thank you!

 

 

Hello Simon R,

The blade is not touching my table. It is in the air, I would never let the blade touch any surface without laying it on something like the sword bag I laid it on. The perspective of the picture makes it seem so.

 

Greetings,

Lex van der Jagt

 

Much relieved - and my apologies for assuming the worst!

[Nihonto student]

Dear Lex,

 

for a new shirasaya I suggest you Mr. Movilli in Italy...more than 20 years experience in the field and he use real magnolia wood from Japan.

This is his website http://www.Japanese-sword.it/index.html where you can also find the price list for the various services offered.

 

Greetings,

Giordy

[ROKUJURO]

You could also ask Sergio da Silva Correia Martins in Den Haag. He might know craftsmen nearby.
 

[Stephen]

First I'd reach out to Mike Y.

 

Did you add habaki? Looks like it's bent in right spot.

 

Very puzzling indeed. 

 

Very lovely blade BTW

Edited January 23, 2024 by Stephen
Add comment

[Lexvdjagt]

19 hours ago, Jussi Ekholm said:

In the UK, Mike Hickman Smith. I haven't have personally any work done by him but I know he does great stuff. Our UK members will know more about him and could pass you the contact info.

Hello Jussi,

 

Thank you for your recommendation. Unfortunately shipping to the UK would be very expensive due to Brexit. I think it would cost me more money than the sword is worth. Although I do not have a good proper idea of the value of the blade in this condition. So any indication of price would be appreciated.

 

2 hours ago, Nihonto student said:

Dear Lex,

 

for a new shirasaya I suggest you Mr. Magotti in Italy...more than 20 years experience in the field and he use real magnolia wood from Japan.

This is his website http://www.Japanese-sword.it/index.html where you can also find the price list for the various services offered.

 

Greetings,

Giordy

Thank you Giordy,

 

I will definitely consider Mr.Magotti, I think the price is very reasonable.

 

11 minutes ago, Stephen said:

First I'd reach out to Mike Y.

 

Did you add habaki? Looks like it's bent in right spot.

 

Very puzzling indeed. 

Thank you for the recommendation,

I did not purchase the habaki, the person I bought it from bought it during a meeting of the Token club here in the Netherlands. Although it does not seem to fit, it does not immediately seem bent.

 

Greetings,

Lex van der Jagt

[Stephen]

Lex 

I ment that it had correct bend to fit the ji

[Lexvdjagt]

Yes that is certainly true, I am just not used to that much space between the habaki and the blade. So I was alarmed at first. Do you have any idea what the blade would be worth in this condition? To give me a rough idea if it is worth the shirasaya. The blade has no rust and only some foraging imperfections.

16 minutes ago, Stephen said:

Lex 

I ment that it had correct bend to fit the ji

 

[Stephen]

LEX you know very hard to tell from photos. If Ray can't offer a quote I'd go to the horse mouth. Mike Y.

 

https://www.facebook...endo?mibextid=ZbWKwL

 

I've been out of the market way to long.

[Jussi Ekholm]

Chiyozuru is unfortunately not a "premium" tier attribution. I checked and NBTHK attributed mumei Chiyozuru katana seem to run around 400k to 800k yen from Japanese dealers. Many of them have koshirae in package. Very few of them are Tokubetsu Hozon and Hozon seems to be the most common attribution paper. The short length of yours is bit negative when you think about the price. However it does seem to be in nice condition.

 

However it must be noted that pricing in Europe & US is bit different to Japan, and I base majority of my prices from Japanese dealers. And I don't really care about business side of things.

There are multiple Japanese Sword dealers in the Netherlands who might give a much better estimate to you. And they could evaluate the sword in person too.