Unsigned Type 98 check

[Paul G]

Hello everyone,

This is the first thread that I have started. I have an unsigned type 98 that came out of a GI footlocker about 15 years ago. This, along with many other items were brought home from the pacific. To me, its a well used Army officers shin gunto in type 98 mounts.  I will be selling this and just wanted to make sure I am not missing something. By definition, it is a wakizashi blade in a bit longer scabbard. I thought I read here that a wakizashi shin gunto in type 98 mounts, made during the war period was uncommon? Can anyone confirm if this looks like a shingunto blade, or older than that. Just trying to understand this sword fully.

 

Thank you all for your comments,

 

Paul G-

[Paul G]

other pics

[Paul G]

more

[John C]

3 hours ago, Paul G said:

I read here that a wakizashi shin gunto in type 98 mounts, made during the war

Paul:

From those pics it does look like a showato type 98, however wakizashi were not made during the war to my knowledge. Two things could have happened; a sword meeting the minimum specs could have been donated or taken from home; or it could have been shortened during a field repair. There was an entire unit that did those.

If the tassel is original, that is a plus.

Just my opinion,

John C.

 

[robinalexander]

2 hours ago, John C said:

however wakizashi were not made during the war to my knowledge.

Hi John,

 

Wakizashi's were made during WW2 but very rare....see attached thread

 

 

 

[robinalexander]

Paul, 

 

If your measurement (second picture) of the nagasa is correct at 23 5/8 inches which is 60.0075 cm ..... to me, it would make it a katana not a wakizashi (30 to 60 cms).  Although I accept there may be differing or more correct definitions of blade length for katana/wakizashi and if that is the case, hopefully someone will chime in. 

 

In any event from what I see, this really is border line, therefore it would be important to include the exact nagasa measurement in your advertisement so any prospective buyer was well aware of the actual blade length and could draw their own conclusions.   

 

But it is in Type 98 mounts and a nice WW2 package ... could you post any clearer close pics of the nakago/tang (both sides)?

 

Rob

 

 

[Paul G]

3 hours ago, John C said:

Paul:

From those pics it does look like a showato type 98, however wakizashi were not made during the war to my knowledge. Two things could have happened; a sword meeting the minimum specs could have been donated or taken from home; or it could have been shortened during a field repair. There was an entire unit that did those.

If the tassel is original, that is a plus.

Just my opinion,

John C.

 

Hi John, Its hard to see, but the tassel is original to the sword. You can tell with these better pictures. Thanks for your comments

[Paul G]

Here are a couple more pictures of the nakago.

[Paul G]

21 minutes ago, robinalexander said:

Paul, 

 

If your measurement (second picture) of the nagasa is correct at 23 5/8 inches which is 60.0075 cm ..... to me, it would make it a katana not a wakizashi (30 to 60 cms).  Although I accept there may be differing or more correct definitions of blade length for katana/wakizashi and if that is the case, hopefully someone will chime in. 

 

In any event from what I see, this really is border line, therefore it would be important to include the exact nagasa measurement in your advertisement so any prospective buyer was well aware of the actual blade length and could draw their own conclusions.   

 

But it is in Type 98 mounts and a nice WW2 package ... could you post any clearer close pics of the nakago/tang (both sides)?

 

Rob

 

 

Thanks for your input Rob. I couldn't get the habaki off and didn't want to cut myself trying. I put the end of the tape at what I felt would be the notch in the blade, so the nagasa is really close to 23 5/8. I always thought  a Katana was roughly over 24 inches. Good to know. Thanks for your thoughts! 

[John C]

In the close ups, the tassel looks blue/brown, which would make it a company grade (Lieutenant, Captain, or warrant officer). Also, the ito may be a re-wrap. Note the uneven spacing and direction of the twists. Rob would be able to give you a better answer on that, however. 

 

John C.

[Paul G]

In hand you can see the blue brown a lot clearer. Also, to me the ito looks original. Its very dirty and has been well used. Its easier to see in hand. Thanks for your comments! 

[Tensho]

I wouldn't call this a Wakizashi.  And as was just mentioned,  the ito is incorrectly wrapped. And the "diamonds" aren't very well done. Someone appears to have re-wrapped this. Ito looks to have a decent amount of soiling though.

 

The seppa are also incorrect.  The "O-Seppa" are added. There shouldn't be 4. Some appear to be numbered, others don't match. This maybe a replacement tsuka and a bunch of seppa were added to make it fit. 

[Paul G]

OK, Good to know. Thanks for the input .I guess there is no telling what the GI did after he got this sword. There were a few others with it, as well as other items. Maybe he got some things mixed up when took them apart (seppa) . The ito and knot look so old and soiled, I'm scratching my head. Is there any way the ito could have been wrapped in the period by the koshirae maker? A less skilled wrapper? It really feels in hand like its been this way forever.

 

Thanks 

[Paul G]

Another picture of the ito.

[Paul G]

.

[Bryce]

G'day Paul,

Can you please post a close-up photo of the kissaki of your sword. From your original photos it doesn't look very good.

Cheers,

Bryce

 

[Paul G]

The Kissaki

 

[Paul G]

[Tensho]

Here's how the ito should look(3 of mine )

 

I can't speculate when yours was re-wrapped. The ito alternates for a reason(so if it is torn it won't just unravel) is there any additional holes visible inside the tsuka? I wouldn't be questioning it to much if all the seppa were correct, but at least 5 look added(the hole for the Chuso/locking mechanism on the seppa have been elongated) 

[Bruce Pennington]

Paul,

First, your name sounds really familiar.  Do we know each other from somewhere?  If not, no worries, I'm bad with names anyway!

 

Do you know the fellow that owned the footlocker?  What I'm getting at, is can we know for sure this gunto came directly home from the theatre, or could it have been added to the locker later?  Either way, I guess the issues are the same.

 

This is an odd one.  All the fittings look period legit.  But there are odd things.  Like:

- The 10 seppa, including 2 extra dai-seppa, indicates these fittings were not the original ones, and the extra seppa had to be added to tighten the fit.

- The one-way wrap direction of the ito, as mentioned, is standard for Chinese work, not Japanese

- The blade, overall seems good, yet the almost squared off kissaki, with poor shinogiji/yokote hint towards Chinese work

- Can't tell from the photos - is the hamon acid etched artificially?  Or is it a real hamon?

- Lastly, adding to the idea that the fittings were not original, the fit of the habaki.  It has a huge gap on the mune.  

 

It should be tight, like this:

 

All said, though, if you think, or know, that this came home from the war this way, I could easily postulate theories as to how it got this way.  For example, the officer/owner was stationed in China during the war.  Due to damage, his fittings had to be replaced.  That could explain the ill-fitting fittings.  Even the ito could have been wrapped by a local worker, in China, explaining the one-way turns.

 

I don't know.  These things are really hard to pin down with certainty.  Clarity on the hamon would help, a bit.

[Paul G]

Thank you everyone for your input. I can say with certainty the sword came out of a footlocker, but the family had very little information about their relative who served. I was able to see most of the stuff in there and picked this sword up pretty cheap. I got another sword and a type 14 Nambu as well. All they said is that he served in the Pacific, but who knows. They stated that there were other swords that they had sold already. I was not the first person to get access. Its very hard to tell, but the hamon looks real, but very hard to photograph. Its only visible in certain light. Does not look like other fake acid etched sword hamons that I have seen.

Bruce, I tend to post over at WAF and WRF. I am the Paul G who found the ebay auction with the "NLF /souvenir  sword" and PX sales paperwork.

Matt, I dont see any extra holes inside the Tsuka

In any case, it looks like its been modified a bit, for any number of reasons. Where, who knows, Why ?? , possibly by the Vet, but am very confident it was not by the family. At worst, they may have shined up the blade a bit, but not sure. I just always had that feeling. I am going to move this along, and will give this link to the new owner. I got it cheap, so I will move it along for what it is. 

 

Thank you everyone, 

[David Flynn]

8 hours ago, John C said:

Paul:

From those pics it does look like a showato type 98, however wakizashi were not made during the war to my knowledge. Two things could have happened; a sword meeting the minimum specs could have been donated or taken from home; or it could have been shortened during a field repair. There was an entire unit that did those.

If the tassel is original, that is a plus.

Just my opinion,

John C.

 

Wakizashi, were definitely made during the war.   I have seen traditional and Showato.  Someone I know has a wak by Okimasa.

 

[Bryce]

G'day Paul,

Thank you for the better photos of the kissaki. In your new photos it doesn't look as bad as it did in the old. The geometry of it is off, but this may just be because it is very worn or perhaps it was damaged and reshaped.

Cheers,

Bryce