zanilu Posted October 13, 2023 Report Posted October 13, 2023 Dear All I am in the process of revising my collection catalog and I have just realized ho indiscriminate I was at the beginning of my collecting career in acquiring pieces. Initially I bought what I liked with little discerning... I would like to have your help in classifying some of my earlier acquisitions. Following is the first one. I will add later others as going though the collection I have doubts about them. Please feel free to give your guess and comments. If possible please also justify the attribution to make the thread as instructive as possible Regards Luca Quote
zanilu Posted October 13, 2023 Author Report Posted October 13, 2023 FT-0004 Dragon in waves (nami ryū zu - 波竜図) Tsuba Jū-mokkogata (木瓜形), tetsu-ji (磨地), sukidashi-bori (鋤出彫), ke-bori (毛彫), kin iroe (金色絵), maru-mimi (丸耳), ryō-hitsuana (両櫃孔). Dimensions: 80.3 mm x 75.4 mm. Thikness 3.9 mm at seppa dai, 3.4 at mimi. Material: Iron Is Jū-mokkogata (木瓜形) is right or it is better kikku-gata (菊花形)? Regards Luca 3 Quote
Spartancrest Posted October 13, 2023 Report Posted October 13, 2023 This guide describes Kikka-gata as "Kikuka-gata" This one as "Kiku-gata" And this one as "Kikka gata" Well there is certainly no consistency with spelling! You get more hits with KIKU-GATA in searches. https://www.Japanese...kikugata-iron-tsuba/ a plain guard with Chrysanthemum outline. 3 Quote
zanilu Posted October 13, 2023 Author Report Posted October 13, 2023 Thanks Dale. On 10/13/2023 at 10:57 AM, Spartancrest said: You get more hits with KIKU-GATA in searches. Expand I used exactly this criteria when deciding the spelling to use. Luca Quote
SteveM Posted October 13, 2023 Report Posted October 13, 2023 I think you are safe with Jū-mokkō-gata (十木瓜形). My bias would have been towards Kikka-gata (菊花形), but having looked in Iimura's "Tōken Yōran" which is a little almanac on swords first published in the 60s, I see he uses Jū-mokkō-gata for this kind of 10-lobed tsuba. And having double-checked with some papered tsuba, I see that NBTHK also uses "mokkō-gata" for tsuba with scalloped edges (8 or 10 or 12 lobes), always including the number of lobes when there are more than the default 4 lobes. But I don't expect these terms to be used with any consistency nowadays. You could call it Kikka-gata and get very little argument from anyone. Adding the entry from Iimura just for reference. I'm sure we could find examples where other authorities use other terms (as Dale has shown above). 7 Quote
zanilu Posted October 13, 2023 Author Report Posted October 13, 2023 Thank you for the clarification Steve,very informative! Regards Luca Quote
MauroP Posted October 15, 2023 Report Posted October 15, 2023 Ciao Luca, nice tsuba BTW. A remark on typo: 磨地 reads migaki-ji (smooth surface), tetsu-ji is 鉄地. About an attribution I’d suggest Hizen (thoght hitsu-ana shape could also point to an Higo school). Quote
zanilu Posted October 15, 2023 Author Report Posted October 15, 2023 Ciao Mauro. I stand corrected for the kanji. I had the same idea about Hizen based on the hitsu Ana as you said I will also consider Higo now that you mention it. Grazie! Luca Quote
Soshin Posted October 15, 2023 Report Posted October 15, 2023 On 10/13/2023 at 7:00 PM, SteveM said: My bias would have been towards Kikka-gata (菊花形), but having looked in Iimura's "Tōken Yōran" which is a little almanac on swords first published in the 60s, I see he uses Jū-mokkō-gata for this kind of 10-lobed tsuba. And having double-checked with some papered tsuba, I see that NBTHK also uses "mokkō-gata" for tsuba with scalloped edges (8 or 10 or 12 lobes), always including the number of lobes when there are more than the default 4 lobes. Expand Jū-mokkō-gata is now I would describe the shape of the tsuba. It is also how the NBTHK would describe the shape of the tsuba on a paper. 1 1 Quote
zanilu Posted October 19, 2023 Author Report Posted October 19, 2023 FT-0008 Iron tsuba signed ??ken Eiju with kakihan. Dimensions 69.3 mm x 66.4 mm, thickness 4.5 mm at seppa-dai, 3.8 mm at mimi. Considering the quality and comparing the mei with a papered example I provisionally classified it as gimei Tetsugendo. What is your opinion? Regards Luca Quote
Brian Posted October 19, 2023 Report Posted October 19, 2023 Seiryuken Eiju, very typical of their (workshop?) dragon work. Don't see any reason to think it's gimei, they did hundreds if not thousands. 1 1 Quote
zanilu Posted October 19, 2023 Author Report Posted October 19, 2023 Thank you Brian This is one of my earliest acquisitions, my dragon period I would say. Since then my interest drifted somewhere else. My knowledge of Tetsugendo school is limited. Regards Luca Quote
Spartancrest Posted October 19, 2023 Report Posted October 19, 2023 Some more information here from an older thread. The circled seal/kao is one of several used by the Seiryuken craftsmen - same as on your piece. . 3 Quote
zanilu Posted October 20, 2023 Author Report Posted October 20, 2023 Thank you Dale. As usual we can trust you will come up with a lot of info! Regard Luca 1 Quote
1kinko Posted October 20, 2023 Report Posted October 20, 2023 Gimei or not, they do seem to have cranked them out. This one is a different shape, but with the same lousy mei and kao. 1 Quote
Spartancrest Posted October 21, 2023 Report Posted October 21, 2023 On 10/19/2023 at 4:19 PM, zanilu said: FT-0008 Iron tsuba signed ??ken Eiju with kakihan. Dimensions 69.3 mm x 66.4 mm, thickness 4.5 mm at seppa-dai, 3.8 mm at mimi. Expand This is going off topic but I could not miss that the guard has had a hole drilled through it in the seppa-dai then refilled with silver/lead? It reminded me of one from another thread. A remnant from a locking device perhaps? 1 Quote
zanilu Posted October 21, 2023 Author Report Posted October 21, 2023 Yes Dale it could be. I had the same feeling. The filling material looks like lead to me. I have a nicer tsuba that I think could be classified as Washida that has a similar hole but not filled. Regards Luca 1 1 Quote
thutson Posted October 21, 2023 Report Posted October 21, 2023 I also have a tsuba with a hole in the seppa-dia, in case its useful, here's the thread. Best, Tom 1 Quote
zanilu Posted November 1, 2023 Author Report Posted November 1, 2023 Dear all Another bunch of dragon in the cloud for your assessment. Any consideration from your side is welcome. Regards Luca FT-0013 Iron tsuba mumei. Dimensions 67.9 mm x 64.0 mm, thickness 3.1 mm at seppa-dai, 3.1 mm at mimi. Quote
zanilu Posted November 1, 2023 Author Report Posted November 1, 2023 FT-0018 Menuki dimensions 59.9 mm x 15.0 mm, thk 5.4 mm and 61.2 mm x 14.0 mm x 4.1 mm. Quote
zanilu Posted November 1, 2023 Author Report Posted November 1, 2023 FT-0025 Iron tsuba mumei. Dimensions 83.7 mm x 76.6 mm, thickness 5.7 mm at seppa-dai, 3.6 mm at mimi. 1 Quote
zanilu Posted November 1, 2023 Author Report Posted November 1, 2023 FT-0045 Dragon shakudo menuki Dimensions 100.5 mm x 17.3 mm x 6.9 mm and 101.5 mm x 19.1 mm x 7.0 mm. 1 Quote
zanilu Posted November 1, 2023 Author Report Posted November 1, 2023 FT-0021 Nioi shakudo menuki Dimensions 31.8 mm x 14.5 mm x 4.4 mm and 32.4 mm x 14.8 mm x 5.0 mm. 1 Quote
Bazza Posted November 2, 2023 Report Posted November 2, 2023 Luca, nice, NIO btw. Are these papered?? I think they are Unno Shomin school, Mito province. See Legacy Art here: https://www.legacysw...-unno-school-menuki/ Note Ted Tenold's comment: The meticulously placed star shaped chikaragane around the posts are yet another qualitative touch that immediately show the dedication to craftsmanship through details, and a hallmark Unno touch. I must say, though, that I don't see the level of detail exhibited in the Legacy Art menuki. I have a pair of NIO in shakudo, also Mito, that have heavy posts. BaZZa. 2 Quote
zanilu Posted November 2, 2023 Author Report Posted November 2, 2023 Thank you Bazza. I will look into Unno Shomin school. As you said the menuki on Legacy Art are another level of quality compared to mine. Regards Luca Quote
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