Value of Second Hand Pottery

[Xander Chia]

Hello, I would like to ask if being second hand/used affects the value of contemporary items like bowls, cups and pots. And by how much.

 

I purchased a few items and am wondering if the lower prices of second hand items were worth it. Thanks.

[Matsunoki]

Xander, difficult question to answer. Are we talking about everyday utility pieces, mass produced or are we talking craftsman/artisan made one off items that were originally sold as art? And how contemporary are we talking….a few years or longer?…

Best.Colin
 

[Xander Chia]

21 hours ago, Matsunoki said:

Xander, difficult question to answer. Are we talking about everyday utility pieces, mass produced or are we talking craftsman/artisan made one off items that were originally sold as art? And how contemporary are we talking….a few years or longer?…

Best.Colin
 

I’m not gonna lie I have no idea if they’re mass produced or unique items. Neither do I know when they were made. At which point in time does an item become ‘second hand’ rather than ‘vintage’? Here’s a bowl I got last year.

[Matsunoki]

Xander, there are a few experts in Japanese studio pottery on this forum but I’m not one of them so my opinion doesn’t count for much. 
I think  we are looking at a fairly modern piece of studio pottery and the value will depend on the fame or reputation of the artist and/or it’s age.  I can’t comment on value.

As a general rule the best reason to buy this sort of item is because you love it. Buying it secondhand will probably save you a few Dollars but mostly these items were not expensive in the first place. EBay is absolutely full of similar. 
A nice collection could be put together without spending a lot.

Happy collecting.

Colin

[Xander Chia]

2 hours ago, Matsunoki said:

Xander, there are a few experts in Japanese studio pottery on this forum but I’m not one of them so my opinion doesn’t count for much. 
I think  we are looking at a fairly modern piece of studio pottery and the value will depend on the fame or reputation of the artist and/or it’s age.  I can’t comment on value.

As a general rule the best reason to buy this sort of item is because you love it. Buying it secondhand will probably save you a few Dollars but mostly these items were not expensive in the first place. EBay is absolutely full of similar. 
A nice collection could be put together without spending a lot.

Happy collecting.

Colin

Thanks Collin. While I do like the ones I currently have I sometimes find others I’m more interested in.

[Matsunoki]

2 hours ago, Xander Chia said:

I sometimes find others I’m more interested in.

Temptation lurks around every corner and mouse click doesn’t it? I know what you mean!……have fun.

Best. Colin 

[OceanoNox]

Concerning potters (and watching Marcus Sesko's lecture, this was the case for tousougu, and many more crafted items), items can be a group effort: someone prepares the clay, another the shape, another the coating, and another fires them all. Or the master makes everything himself. When looking at the Takatoriyaki tradition, workshop items made by students or not to the standard of the master (but still to the standard of the workshop) will have a specific stamp at the bottom, while the masters have their own. The price, then, varies accordingly: if the item carries the name of a contemporary head of a tradition or a recognized artist, even second hand items would be expensive.

A recent book on new pieces showed price going from about 20,000 yen to more than 10 times that (the styles varied very much: rough clay with pebbles in it, bowls that looked almost like dry wood, etc.).

 

In terms of price, it also depends on who is selling: in Japan, you can often find good second pieces at very low prices, because the person selling won't practice anymore and they are simply trying to get rid of it, and they'd rather sell it for cheap or even give it to someone who will practice and use them.

 

I haven't practiced in a while, but in the Urasenke tradition of tea ceremony, I did not feel that price mattered much. Rather the atmosphere created when using them is what matters. In that case, what you like, and what you bring are most important.

[Mark S.]

On 9/3/2023 at 9:06 PM, OceanoNox said:

I did not feel that price mattered much. Rather the atmosphere created when using them is what matters. In that case, what you like, and what you bring are most important.

Completely agree with the above and would only add, how well can you make the tea in the bowl (sometimes trickier than you think) and how much will your guest enjoy the bowl in context of the rest of the tea ceremony.

[OceanoNox]

23 minutes ago, Mark S. said:

how much will your guest enjoy the bowl in context of the rest of the tea ceremony

Exactly!

There is an anecdote of Rikyu attending a tea gathering with some of his students. The host was either not a veteran, or very nervous, but he missed some steps, spilled some water, etc. Apparently some of Rikyu's students snickered or exchanged looks of embarrassment, but at the end, Rikyu said "your temae was supreme". On the way back, the students were astonished, but Rikyu replied that the intent and honesty of the host were more important than doing everything perfectly.