Help with a pair of dragon menuki

[Marco]

Hi all,

I recently got this pair of menuki. 
 

I’d like to get your insights about them.

Not the best quality but they look legit to my untrained eyes.

 

My only doubt is about the color of the back: I used to see some dark spot indicating the Shakudo alloy.

 

Thanks in advance for any provided help

Marco 
 

 

[Stephen]

Like them very much.

[1kinko]

If the kon and chikaragane are gold colored it’s likely been plated and the underlying metal color will bleed through over time.

[Marco]

 

8 hours ago, 1kinko said:

If the kon and chikaragane are gold colored it’s likely been plated and the underlying metal color will bleed through over time.

Thanks!

[DoTanuki yokai]

To my untrained eye they look like pure gold and of  high quality. 
I look at how thin it is and that alone is a sign for quality and I wonder why they would make it this thin when it is not gold. 

[Franco]

Will be termed "solid gold" , the question becomes what percentage?

A good jeweler should be able to determine. The other question is what other metals were used, copper, silver?

 

Regards,

[vajo]

They are nice.

whats the size and weight?

[Larason2]

I'm not an expert, but I would think that if they were solid gold, they should have the same texture and colour on the inside as outside. Gold develops a patina, but the inside of the menuki don't look like any patinated gold I've seen. I agree getting them appraised by a jeweller is the way to go.

[Matsunoki]

The “face” of these nice menukiwill have been heavily worked/carved and then polished. It would give a totally different appearance to the underside which would be left more or less untouched. Also gold does not generally develop a “patina”….the colour is determined by the carat of the alloy and what it is alloyed with eg copper gives a “rose gold” tint.
Ok we are just looking at images but these have a very pure colouration…..18ct plus, possibly 24 carat although that would make them very soft. Don’t know what the Japanese craftsman used as alloys…..if anything. Also depends on how the menuki were made.  Could be cast and then finished or worked up from a solid sheet.

These have the appearance of solid gold.

Do they feel disproportionately heavy in your hand?

I would definitely get them tested.

 

[Brian]

Pair of solid gold menuki I have here to take to the show for sale tested as 9K

[1kinko]

The kon and chikaragane are soldered in place, normally using tin, lead, or silver  (rarely). These menuki show no signs of white solders. It would also be highly unusual to use gold for these supports that are never seen again, once mounted. 

[Winchester]

I am a newer collector so please take my opinion with 'a grain of salt' or maybe a few grains.  I have been studying fittings daily for about 6-7 months as I am trying to better understand more about this. The gold menuki is a sub-category I have been reading about and enjoying. There are probably no maxims or universal truths but here are my thoughts in descending order.

 

-Take to a jeweler to see if they have the equipment to render an expert opinion;

-I have seen many examples which chikaragane are gold; examples have been papered;

-I think Brian made a very relevant point; that is, what percentage? I THINK one of the challenges is that there doesn't appear to be a standard gold content and it would mostly be mixed with silver. They may be 'solid gold' but is it 9kt, 14kt, 18kt? I believe this is one of the challenges in determining without testing or grading it--and with these variables--why it is a challenge to render an opinion.

-ALL purported or papered 'solid gold' menuki I have seen have a quality level (so-to-speak) that may take a minute to recognize or distinguish, but the quality will or should be present.

 

Just my opinion and hopefully worth the admission price.