wakizashi I’m thinking of purchasing, help on identifying

[Jon]

I know the pictures are not great but I’m thinking of purchasing this Wakizashi, the blade nagasa is 47cm, It comes with a kogatana with a really nice looking Kozuka ( I’m really drawn to the Kozuka.)

 

Sorry I have no shots of the Nakago, which is a shame. What are thoughts, is this worth a purchase as a study piece ?

 

 

[ROKUJURO]

Jon,

what can you see in this blade that you want to study? Does it have a complete HAMON running through to the KISSAKI? Is it a WAKIZASHI or a NAGINATA NAOSHI? Is the a HADA visible?

I like the SUGATA, but without even showing the NAKAGO, what advice could I giver?

It all comes down to the purchasing price and to your willingness to risk a certain amounnt of money. Most people have a personal limit for losses.

[Jon]

Cheers Jean

 

As you say without a picture of the Nakago it’s a real punt. Unfortunately auction houses in the UK tend to be rubbish at providing the pictures and images you need ( I’ve asked for shots of the Nakago), without that I’m thinking £200-250 as a punt.

 

Jonathan 

[ROKUJURO]

Considering the KOGATANA which seems to be nice (judged by photos only), that price range might be o.k. and an acceptable risk. But as I said, it depends on the depth of your pockets....

In any case, if the KOSHIRAE was the original one (rare AIKUCHI mount for a WAKIZASHI sized blade) and is complete, it might prove to be interesting.

[Jon]

Hi Jean

 

a few shots of the Aikuchi mount Koshirae, I did not realise Aikuchi mounts were rare on Wakizashi ? 
 

I have to say the kogatana and koshirae do appeal as it’s completely different from my first Nihonto which has katana koshirae.

[Moley]

Hi Jon,

My humble opinion.

£250 = pennies

You can't go wrong IMHO. The Kozuka maybe worth that.

Looks nice as an overall piece.

Saya repair and Tsuka Ito easily done at home.

Cannot comment on Blade condition, but looks GENUINE.

 

[Guest Simon R]

16 hours ago, Moley said:

Saya repair and Tsuka Ito easily done at home.

 

 

I respectfully beg to differ. 
I believe this koshirae was never designed for tsuka-Ito. Instead, it is missing two menuki glued directly onto the same.

Also, Ito is not easily done at home.

Edited June 15, 2023 by SRDRowson
"Doh!" moment.

[Matsunoki]

21 hours ago, Moley said:

Saya repair and Tsuka Ito easily done at home.

Saya repair is not easy either!!…..not if you want it to look good. This one looks very tricky with main seam spilt and kozuka slot smashed outwards……..usually caused by dropping the saya with the kozuka still in it. The you have to try and match the lacquer.

[GeorgeLuucas]

Hi Jon, 

Fellow novice and new member here. Any updates on this auction? Were you able to purchase this sword for a reasonable price or did you decide against it?

From what I can see, it looks like Shobu Zukuri Wakizashi. Would be especially cool to me if it's a Naginata Naoshi. Some nice, albeit worse-for-ware fittings. Personally I wouldn't try to restore them, and fondly call their condition "the unforgiving nature of time" 

 

The conditions looks like the hada and boshi would be hidden no matter how hard you looked. Which, as a fellow novice, would be the biggest bummer to me. Maybe a wipe down with non-abraisive cloth and 99% isoproyl alcohol, and a light coating of choji-oil/mineral oil would reveal it's hamon

Not sure what else you could learn from it other than: proper care/storage/assembly, measurements, and identifying geometry features. That being said, learning those things with a sword in-hand has been valuable to me. If it were me, I would likely pass on this particular sword unless it went for the prices you mentioned; and maybe wait for one with more areas I could study. But what speaks to you speaks to you, and that's part of what's fun about this hobby to me; and at the end of the day its your $

Best of luck
Cheers,
-Sam 

[Jon]

Hi all thanks for your advice, a few more shots, I’m not convinced the koshirae was made for this blade. I will let you all know if I decide to buy…it’s still at £160 at present so I will see how the auction goes….( I’m after a nice French court duelling sword at the same time )

 

some more pictures from the auction house, if you look there is a big gap between the  Habaki  and Tsuka so I’m not thinking this is original Aikuchi mount. They have also said they I cannot remove the Habaki without causing damage when I asked for pictures of Nakago…suspicious. But it still comes with that nice Kozuka…..decisions decisions ( do I spend or bank my monthly guilt free spending and go for a better blade in a few months).

 

 

[ROKUJURO]

1 hour ago, Jon said:

.....They .....cannot remove the Habaki without causing damage .....

That is nonsense. You will only have to remove the TSUKA, then the HABAKI will slide off backwards.

Looking at the photos I have the impression that the blade might be interesting but you cannot be sure about hidden flaws like HAGIRE or FUKURE under the surface. 

[Jon]

34 minutes ago, ROKUJURO said:

That is nonsense. You will only have to remove the TSUKA, then the HABAKI will slide off backwards.

Looking at the photos I have the impression that the blade might be interesting but you cannot be sure about hidden flaws like HAGIRE or FUKURE under the surface. 

unless someone has done something stupid like glueing the Tsuka to the Nakago.

 

[Jon]

11 hours ago, SRDRowson said:

I respectfully beg to differ. 
I believe this koshirae was never designed for tsuka-Ito. Instead, it is missing two menuki glued directly onto the same.

Also, Ito is not easily done at home.

Hi is that something that occurred, Koshirae without Tsuka-Ito and Menuki glued on directly?

 

cheers

 

jon

[ROKUJURO]

Jon,

yes, it is standard for AIKUCHI.

[Jon]

Well in the end I did not get the blade, it’s went for £1200 or $1500 which I personally think is well over the odds for a blade in that condition…on to the next one.

[Moley]

Ahh well.. 

[Ooitame]

@Jon a little pricey, looks like a decent study or restoration piece. Too bad no shots of the bare blade, I can see the habaki has wiggle as can be seen by some polish underneath. This to me would be a bit concerning. I agree, the Kozuka is nice!

[Ed]

Good pass on your part. Kozuka was decent but that is all you would have been buying. Sword was not worth the cost of restoration. 

 

Kogatana is signed Sagami no Kami Masatsune. 

Famous Owari smith, but this one was gimei as many are.

[Matsunoki]

Someone gambling on it being an old long naginata? You can just about see a wide choji/wild gunome hamon in places. The “shine” behind the habaki is whatever the new nakago finish is. 

[Ooitame]

5 hours ago, Matsunoki said:

Someone gambling on it being an old long naginata? You can just about see a wide choji/wild gunome hamon in places. The “shine” behind the habaki is whatever the new nakago finish is. 

I was thinking that, the shape fits.