Beginner Tsuba collector

[Nanako]

Hi all,

 

    I am new to the forum and am interested in learning more about tsuba. I have one that I’d like to show and maybe get some thoughts or information on it. Thank you.

[Nanako]

[Spartancrest]

Hi Amber welcome to NMB! That is a popular design of butterflies and Peony. You might notice that even though the 'pattern' is the same each tsuba is ever so slightly different and are therefore "Utsushi". Not direct copies but 'emulations', also not cast but hand worked, produced almost on a production line to keep up with demand. I am not sure if I have seen any that were signed but just as a guess I would say Shoami school?

There are two selling on ebay right now - they are described as a 'Daisho' but the sizes of the butterflies would suggest they were made as separate pieces and are really a 'cobbled' together pair. https://www.ebay.com/itm/144814259209

Another for sale ebay described as Aizu Shoami  https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/285253214594 You might notice the direction of the top butterfly is upwards like the one on your guard. There is evidence that your guard was mounted on a sword at one time from the 'seppa shadow' and the tagane-ato - punch mark at the bottom of the nakago-ana [tang hole]

 

[Nanako]

Thank you Dale for the information. I recently just got into collecting mainly Tsuba but I am interested in other Japanese sword fittings as well. Do you have any books for beginners that you recommend? Something I can learn about the schools and styles. Also what makes a Tsuba valuable and what to look for and what to avoid when collecting.

thanks again.

[rematron]

Hi Amber.  A great and inexpensive book I was recently turned on to by another member here is “Lethal Elegance” by Joe Earle.  It’s available on Amazon so it was very easy to obtain.  It has wonderful large full color photos and covers many different styles and schools of tsuba and other fittings.  Welcome to the hobby.  It’s a fun one!   -Jeremy

[Spartancrest]

Amazon is not necessarily the cheapest option,  Biblio has some for around the $10 mark. Local shipping will vary. 

A ten minute search can save a lot of money.

https://www.biblio.com/book/lethal-elegance-art-samurai-sword-fittings/d/1538466509

https://www.abebooks.com/book-search/title/lethal-elegance-the-art-of-samurai-sword-fittings/

 

Hard cover - https://www.ebay.com/p/30782526

mixed bag - https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2322090.m570.l1313&_nkw=Lethal+Elegance+%3A+Samurai+Sword+Fittings+by+Joe+Earle&_sacat=0

 

I agree with Jeremy, an excellent book with beautiful images - Pieces are possibly for the upper end of the collecting market, but objects to aspire to.

 

[Nanako]

Thank you. I actually just purchased that book the other day. I’m very excited to read and see the tsuba pictures and learn everything I can. I’m also thinking of purchasing another Tsuba soon. When I do I would like to post a picture and get your opinions but I first want to do some research before I decide which to get. Thank you! 

[Steves87]

That is a good idea, just post the pictures though, not the link. Most people here would be pretty honest with not poaching a guard, but best to be sure.

Is there a particular style you like? For example sukashi (open work) or inlays (like you have already), different shapes, motifs, or themes?

[1kinko]

Yesterday I was at the Ashmolean Museum where I was allowed to handle and photograph the 15 Ishiguro School tsuba they own. Arthur Church mainly collected kinko tsuba but also inlaid iron tsuba.  Check out their website, arranged by school.

[Nanako]

Since I’ve been looking around I really like mokko-gata shape. I like all shapes but that is my favorite. My taste is changing daily the more I read and see. I like the themes with flowers, the sea, animals and mostly nature themes. Every Tsuba I see I think is beautiful I enjoy looking at them and figuring out  the meaning behind them. I really like Nanako and Tsuba that have a nice pattern in the metal. Sorry if I’m not using the words correctly this is a new interest to me and I’m learning daily. Especially since it’s another language that I don’t know it makes it harder to describe the word I’m trying to use but I am trying my best to remember the words and the meaning. Thank you. 

[Bazza]

Amber, imagine being 10 years in the future and looking back.  You will be amazed at your journey and where it took you and what your view is 'then'.  I've been a blade person for 60 years, but I do follow tsuba and tosogu and have a small eclectic collection.  For tsuba and discussions alone you will find this Board an amazing place to be and wonder how you found time to go to work!!!  However, for a close to the truth, if not the bone view of collecting tsuba one of my favourite tsuba reads is this one below.  Its a bottler...  Do give us your thoughts when you've read it.

 

Best regards, and to finish with a great closing quote of a famous Nihontou sensei "Gambatte kudasai".

 

BaZZa.

aka Barry Thomas.

 

 

[Nanako]

Hello Bazza,

Thank you for that info. I took some time to read and it was very interesting. I really enjoy Tsuba and reading the history and since this is new to me a lot of the vocabulary I’m struggling with but I look up the words I don’t know. I’m waiting for a few books I ordered to get here so I can study them. I like the old iron Tsuba and I like that they have remained for many many years and have so much history. Some are simple and look strong and I like the fact that there’s more than meets the eye with them. I need to study more about the metal and the types of metals and aesthetics and the surface pattern. Kinko is what first caught my eyes though and the stories they tell the more I look at them. I personally think less is more but they are all beautiful. I’m tempted to purchase one that caught my attention (looks like old iron to me) but I’m going to wait for my books and do research first because I don’t want to make a unwise decision when I really don’t know much yet. I really do appreciate this forum and anyone who gives me advice or any information. This is all new to me. But it definitely opened up a door for me for knowledge and learning. Thank you! 

[Nanako]

Bazza,

One more thing I have to mention, “ Hai, ganbarimasu!” I hope that is the correct response! 

[Steves87]

Great post there Bazza.

Amber, you seem to be getting a good grasp on terminology from what we have read so far, and I would say books and online reading is excellent for picking up the terminology. As I have in the past, you may struggle with verbalizing the words when talking to certain people (Japanese speaking mostly). The number of times I have spoken certain Japanese words to my Kenjutsu or Iaido Sensei, with the response of a baffled look, is countless. The prime example when first starting out is the pronunciation of "Tsuka".

 

 

[Spartancrest]

On 5/14/2023 at 6:15 AM, 1kinko said:

Yesterday I was at the Ashmolean Museum where I was allowed to handle and photograph the 15 Ishiguro School tsuba

Show off - you could have invited a few friends!   At least drop the link address in - http://jameelcentre.ashmolean.org/collection/7/10237  

[1kinko]

On 5/13/2023 at 9:15 PM, 1kinko said:

Yesterday I was at the Ashmolean Museum where I was allowed to handle and photograph the 15 Ishiguro School tsuba they own. Arthur Church mainly collected kinko tsuba but also inlaid iron tsuba.  Check out their website, arranged by school.

 

[1kinko]

Yeah Dale and you could have posted the picture I emailed to you too! I’m on the road, trying to avoid people who drive on the wrong side of the road. In about a month I’ll try to post them all. Cheers!

[Spartancrest]

10 hours ago, 1kinko said:

you could have posted the picture I emailed to you too!

I would have but the file size was far too big - [too much nanako?]

Direct link is here - http://jameelcentre.ashmolean.org/collection/8/object/21441

 

 People who drive on the wrong side of the road.  - Hey left is right, right is wrong. [always struck me as funny how the reason for driving on the left gave you an advantage with a sword or pistol if you came across a highwayman trying to rob you - true story - so why does gun loving America drive on the wrong side?] 

[Spartancrest]

On 5/13/2023 at 9:42 AM, Nanako said:

Do you have any books for beginners that you recommend?

Perhaps not a book strickly for beginners as it is in Japanese, but this book is so far selling very cheaply and is a limited edition - might turn out to be a book you will want in the future [when it is hard to find?] https://buyee.jp/item/yahoo/auction/g1091637836   or    https://www.jauce.com/auction/g1091637836

 

You can check other sites from this search list. But I can't see a copy anywhere near as cheap. 

https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=APwXEdfcyrzrh1n-081JXkUbeXvmtEZTSg:1684200767793&q=Zabo+Tansen&tbm=isch&source=univ&fir=6UdtMhmE5Zd5ZM%2C-OoJD7VtBrJDOM%2C_%3BtW54kRsAp6RwWM%2C-OoJD7VtBrJDOM%2C_%3BrkjAj2VxHxUVoM%2CqE3g3f4auJYPHM%2C_%3BEmbAMNceYZFl2M%2COUPGF4mcoSDW6M%2C_%3BbdNdV7Q2NfGwQM%2CwQlwJEu36wMQmM%2C_%3BPJxngSV8dLML0M%2CqE3g3f4auJYPHM%2C_%3Bp9vcKEpMDUU9-M%2COUPGF4mcoSDW6M%2C_%3BKu5rwx2PBrVbFM%2C-XaOF_j5MC--tM%2C_%3Bqbay7I-UfpPrXM%2CwQlwJEu36wMQmM%2C_%3BlxPN_yvGYiISCM%2Cl_BXDNFqecZpUM%2C_&usg=AI4_-kSW_vKT62oWCyqd9vd6EBfS3bcZGQ&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjhi_rj2Pj-AhXaT2wGHTeuBZIQjJkEegQIORAC&biw=1366&bih=657&dpr=1

 

Also a related thread on books found here:

 

[vajo]

As allways - follow your taste is the best advice. Collect what you like not what others think you should like.  

 

[Steves87]

4 hours ago, vajo said:

As allways - follow your taste is the best advice. Collect what you like not what others think you should like.  

 

 

great advice Chris, I would also suggest reading this Haynes Article (shibuiswords.com) (masterpieces). This has been the single most influential piece of writing for me personally, especially the last four paragraphs (para. 7 to 10)

[Stephen]

Hi Amber

Welcome to our world.

Be sure to check the for sale forum. Often very good deals there.

Enjoy your adventure.

 

[Nanako]

Hi Stephen, 

Thank you! I have looked at the for sale forum. Nice stuff. Just received some books. Will be reading them. Thank you. 

[Nanako]

Just want to show you all my second tsuba and would love to hear what you think.

[Nanako]

[Dan tsuba]

Hi Amber and welcome to this fantastic forum.

 

That (to me at least) is a nice tsuba.  I would say it is shakudo (copper with a small amount of gold).  It has nanako ji punch marks (those tiny punch marks on the tsuba) and a nice motif.  Well done!

 

With respect,

Dan

[ROKUJURO]

Hi Amber,

I am less enthousiastic about this TSUBA. It seems to be made of copper and got some black paint or patination to look like SHAKUDO. The design is simple but o.k. The TSUBA looks like NAGOYA-MONO to me which means it was made mainly for sale to tourists at the end of the 19th century.

Anyhow, it does not seem to be a cast copy, but a handmade one, probably produced in numbers.

This is what I believe to guess from the photos. A close 'in-hand' look may reveal if the FUKURIN (rim) is separately made or 'painted-on' gold (colour).

[Nanako]

Hi Jean 

Thank you for your opinion I appreciate it. That’s why I post to get opinions or any knowledge I can on tsuba. I am reading as much as I can and trying to learn whatever I can. To me this Tsuba is attractive and it caught my eye because I like shakudo and Nanako. I also like nature and animal motifs and the fukurin to me looks separately made but then again I don’t have the knowledge that I’m sure you do. I try to collect what I like hoping it’s worth it. I guess the more research and reading I do and experience I get I will be able to know more by just looking. Either way I still like my latest tsuba  and maybe one day I will acquire a gem into my collection! Hopefully. Thanks again. 
 

[Bazza]

Amber, the years will teach you, and all it costs is money!!!

 

BaZZa.

[Spartancrest]

11 hours ago, Nanako said:

To me this Tsuba is attractive

That is the best way to collect. Don't collect to please other people. You have already made choices better than I did to start with!

Take it from me, you don't have to spend thousands of dollars to enjoy this hobby - in fact I enjoy it far more when I can find something really interesting and pay very little!