One with the clouds...

[GoldenDrachen]

Hello everyone

 

I never realised that something like this will appeal to me. However I bought this one

Didn't look at Mei first. Only afterwards found in description that it says "Shigenobu Shoami." Is that so? Would it be then early Edo period?

 

These pics from seller description*

(* Btw I noticed that the way you photograph the tsuba is extremely important. All items I have acquired in reality looked much better than in seller's description)

[Geraint]

Dear Vitaly.

 

Spot on!  Usually read Shoami Shigenobu.  Quite a few of these about and a classic design.  As a matter of interest what size is it?

(I have to agree with you about the 'better in hand' idea.)

 

This one looks like it will improve with a little tsuba fussing.

 

All the best.

[Matsunoki]

Vitaly, hello.

just a thought and I am no tsuba expert but I wonder if the design is of three stylised bats in flight rather than clouds? I feel they are very similar to the way these creatures are depicted in both Japanese and Chinese historical art. I hope they are……

bats are a great subject.

 

@Spartancrest will be of great assistance!

All the best.

Colin

 

[Matsunoki]

Eg….

[GoldenDrachen]

33 minutes ago, Geraint said:

.  As a matter of interest what size is it?

8 X 8.3cm, not so small, I guess.

As per condition it is hard to tell what it may need. May be just a little bit of gentle cleaning and conservation wax. We will see when it arrives.

 

Regards

Vitaly 

 

[rematron]

It was well-loved.  That's for sure.  Mounted on at least two different swords... Got some history, that one!

[GoldenDrachen]

1 hour ago, rematron said:

It was well-loved.  That's for sure.  Mounted on at least two different swords... Got some history, that one!

I like this. Sounds very good 

[Steves87]

Maybe this one relates more to Jean's thread on concentric circles, but in terms of mei, I believe this one is something similar

[Spartancrest]

6 hours ago, Matsunoki said:

I wonder if the design is of three stylised bats in flight rather than clouds?

Well it is possible they might be Bats - one here from the Cleveland Art Museum with two bats and broken fans in raised relief.

Tsuba Kansho has one with two small bats and what might be a Falcon hunting them?  https://tsubakansho.com/tag/sword/

 

I think from the more rounded shapes Vitaly's represent clouds - also possible it could be bats in the clouds?

 

Plenty about interpreted as clouds - but really open for personal interpretation, the first one above has three very regular shapes - ever seen three clouds together exactly alike?  "Two iron tsuba maru-gata decorated in ko-sukashi with stylized clouds." Japan, 17th-18th century  https://drouot.com/en/l/18340202-两件铁制的丸子形饰物

[Spartancrest]

I think we have talked about these cloud shape sukashi before? 

One of mine here, it looks more like a Halloween pumpkin head - It has a break between two 'clouds' that may have been done deliberately[?] giving it a wide 'grin' look.

[Matsunoki]

If we go back to the original tsuba and look at it from an artistic design perspective imo clouds do not make any sense….all at different angles etc but if we look at it and say that’s three bats zooming around it makes perfect sense ….well to me anyway! Japanese often depict bats without the pointy wings and ears being obvious in silhouette ie with one wing often partially folded and the head not showing either as per some on the comparison tsuba above.

Bats are powerful good luck symbols in Japanese folklore and I guess many a Samurai would welcome some luck🙂

As Dale says….open to interpretation but my money is on the winged critters.

All the best

Colin

[GoldenDrachen]

Right..

No consensus on this motif then...

Perhaps every viewer will interpret this in own way.

Still, nice piece though.

 

Thank you, folks, all for the input!

 

Regards

Vitaly