Muromachi Period Tachi Koshirae with intact shirazaya.

[monrason]

Hello, all. New to the forum, and overall world of NBTHK sword interest. 

 

I'd been eyeing eBay for a long time now, looking for a nice katana, and stumbled upon a tachi koshirae with a deerskin sheath with papers dating it to the Muromachi era.

 

I've spent hours researching this concept, and there's surprisingly little that I can find, and some of the information I acquired came from a thread on this site. In short, the skin sheaths, or shirizaya [misspelled in title], were used to protect the scabbard while on horseback and most mentions and the very few pictures that exist show bear or tiger skin/fur. When I bought this, the seller mentioned deerskin, but it seems much more likely to be bearskin based on color/length. Shocked that it's as in tact as it is. Anyway, figured I'd showcase it and get any other information from those much more informed than I.

 

Thank you, more pictures below. 

 

https://imgur.io/gallery/pVCGhmv

 

[Baba Yaga]

Hey Ron,

 

What Country was the seller from? 

 

 

[Rivkin]

They are rare but not unknown.

However I suspect the seller is from Japan and I would personally be a bit more conservative re the date.

[monrason]

17 minutes ago, Baba Yaga said:

Hey Ron,

 

What Country was the seller from? 

 

 

Japan.

[monrason]

8 minutes ago, Rivkin said:

They are rare but not unknown.

However I suspect the seller is from Japan and I would personally be a bit more conservative re the date.

Any specific reason why? Aside from inflating the value? Would there have been many tachis worn, and with a shirazaya made, in a post-katana world? I've read they still existed but weren't very popular in that time. 

[Rivkin]

Depending on status you would have to attend a few events at shrines where you do wear tachi, besides other occasions.

[SteveM]

Hello Ron,

 

I think the title should be "shirizaya" (in Japanese either 尻鞘 or 後鞘, but on the NBTHK certificate they use 後鞘). 

 

The papers don't mention anything about the time period. In other words, the paper doesn't claim its a Muromachi piece.

The certificate says "deer fur", but yes I guess we'd need some kind of DNA test to verify whether its deer or bear. I guess the guys at NBTHK used their experience to guide them on this. 

 

I think the fragile nature of these things, and their relative perceived lack of value (particularly as Japan was modernizing) means that one doesn't find a lot of them on the market nowadays. 

 

Edit: cleaned up a massively confusing typo.

[monrason]

19 minutes ago, Rivkin said:

Depending on status you would have to attend a few events at shrines where you do wear tachi, besides other occasions.

Thank you for the additional information. 

[monrason]

14 minutes ago, SteveM said:

Hello Ron,

 

I think the title should be "shirizaya" (in Japanese either 尻鞘 or 後鞘, but on the NBTHK certificate they use 後鞘). 

 

The papers don't mention anything about the time period. In other words, the paper doesn't claim its a Muromachi piece.

The certificate fur", but yes I guess we'd need some kind of DNA test to verify whether its deer or bear. I guess the guys at NBTHK used their experience to guide them on this. 

 

I think the fragile nature of these things, and their relative perceived lack of value (particularly as Japan was modernizing) means that one doesn't find a lot of them on the market nowadays. 

Thank you for the information. Unfortunate that the papers don't mention a time period, perhaps the seller chose that era due to the significance of the weapon during that period. 

 

Are you saying the certificate mentions that the fur is deer? Or that it does not?

 

And that would make sense, as I've seen only a handful of surviving ones online, and most aren't for sale. 

[SteveM]

Yes - the certificate says the shirizaya is deer fur/hair (鹿毛).

[Baba Yaga]

I did research a long time ago. I don't remember what I came-up with, but I do remember they wouldn't ship tiger tail, or fur into the U.S. Bear may be on that list as well. Don't remember.  

[Baba Yaga]

I did a quick search of the USDA web site. I guess my memory was better than I thought. 

Also from memory Edo comes to mine, but I can't find anything on that. 

 

 

Furs: Most of the world's wild cats, including tigers and such spotted species as jaguar, leopard, ocelot, margay, and leopard cat, are protected. You cannot import skins or items made from, or trimmed with, the fur of these animals. Furs from seals, polar bears, and sea otters are also prohibited.

 

Five regional subpopulations of Ussuri brown bears are now recognized in Hokkaido. Of these, the small size and isolation of the western Ishikari subpopulation has warranted its listing as an endangered species in Japan's Red Data Book.

[Matsunoki]

Ron…..purely for interest, here is mine that I put on the forum a while ago.  The fur on yours looks like Black Bear to me. Never seen a deer that hairy even in their winter coats. You can see what I managed to find out about them in my thread. I don’t think there are many that have survived. Mine is very threadbare!  All the best.Colin

 

[monrason]

8 hours ago, Matsunoki said:

Ron…..purely for interest, here is mine that I put on the forum a while ago.  The fur on yours looks like Black Bear to me. Never seen a deer that hairy even in their winter coats. You can see what I managed to find out about them in my thread. I don’t think there are many that have survived. Mine is very threadbare!  All the best.Colin

 

Wow, beautiful and very rare, Colin. Thank you for the references. Mine looks suspiciously close to your bearskin. You even have the blade! I'm sure mine is in a shirasaya somewhere in someone's home.

 

9 hours ago, Baba Yaga said:

I did a quick search of the USDA web site. I guess my memory was better than I thought. 

Also from memory Edo comes to mine, but I can't find anything on that. 

 

 

Furs: Most of the world's wild cats, including tigers and such spotted species as jaguar, leopard, ocelot, margay, and leopard cat, are protected. You cannot import skins or items made from, or trimmed with, the fur of these animals. Furs from seals, polar bears, and sea otters are also prohibited.

 

Five regional subpopulations of Ussuri brown bears are now recognized in Hokkaido. Of these, the small size and isolation of the western Ishikari subpopulation has warranted its listing as an endangered species in Japan's Red Data Book.

Thank you for this information. Despite the papers stating deer, I wonder if that's just an inaccurate assessment, or intentional misnomer. I also wonder if something this old, I accept it must be newer than Muromachi but still old, is exempt from that importation rule based on age. Regardless, it must've been listed as deer, if it were at all defined with customs, since it got to me. 

 

Ultimately, I treasure this as a rarity that I won't likely find again, regardless of its true age.

 

Very useful information gleaned from this thread/site, thank you all. 

[Baba Yaga]

1 hour ago, monrason said:

I wonder if that's just an inaccurate assessment, or intentional misnomer. Regardless, it must've been listed as deer, if it were at all defined with customs, since it got to me. 

 

Take it to a Taxidermist in regards to the Fur . I know ebay flags words and the government is on it like glue. I inherited a nice watch and thought it had some kind of stone, turned out to be Bear Claw.  

[Wolfmanreid]

Definitely bearskin.  Deer hide would be a poor choice for such an item anyway as the hair tends not to stay in tanned deerskin very well.