Sword registration.

[John Nelson]

asking your help with this card.   A.ny help would be much appreciated thank you . John N.

[DTM72]

Looks like as written on card. Hoshu Takada Jyu Fujiwara Yukinaga 豊州高田住藤原行長 

 

Maybe this guy   https://nihontoclub.com/smiths/YUK354

[John Nelson]

Thank you very much !  for the Information . 

[Grey Doffin]

Hi John,

The card is a license (torokusho) that lists the signature but says nothing about the legitimacy of the signature.

Grey

[DTM72]

13 hours ago, Grey Doffin said:

Hi John,

The card is a license (torokusho) that lists the signature but says nothing about the legitimacy of the signature.

Grey

 

Grey is correct, the torokusho just lists the signatue (if present) and basic dimensions of the blade. It in NO way verifies the signature as being authentic.

[Michaelr]

How many swords have their original license/registration with them? I know that the originals are supposed to be retained by the police but not all are. Would having the original add any value to the blade?  Thanks    
  MikeR

[John Nelson]

Thank you very much , for the information  I have been reading that Bungo swords are usually not gimei ?   

 

[SteveM]

Sad to say this is not the case. There are fakes of Bungo swords. 

 

 

2 hours ago, Michaelr said:

I know that the originals are supposed to be retained by the police but not all are.

 

A sword going out of Japan must have its registration card returned to the issuing authority (usually the prefectural Board of Education). The Ministry of Culture makes this clear on the export documents (well, this is current as of 2021, so the procedure may have changed post-Covid). Prior to the 2000s, there was no requirement to return the registration card. But any registration card on an old sword outside of Japan is considered invalid, and any sword entering Japan has to be newly registered once it is imported. 

 

So swords brought out of Japan up until around 2000 might still have an old registration card attached to them. It doesn't mean the sword is illegal, or that the buyer has any fear of the sword being impounded if it goes back to Japan. Conversely, the registration card also doesn't mean the sword is great, or that even the signature is correct.

 

[Bugyotsuji]

Also worth noting that the dealer has only sent you a photocopy of an original certificate, not the card itself.

[SteveM]

Also, it is dated March 15, 2018, so its not one of the old ones. 

[Brian]

And any with the original card....for any reason at all, have zero added to the value. It is not something remotely sought after.

[Bencld]

I have my original one! Don’t know if it was done on purpose or accidental.