Thoughts on this yamagane Bee and Spider menuki?

[Infinite_Wisdumb]

I can’t place these in the books and resources I have. Thoughts on era or any other info?

[Infinite_Wisdumb]

[Spartancrest]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/255177425983  and  https://soryu.pl/products/shakudo-menuki-with-spider-eating-a-wasp

 

https://www.bonhams.com/auction/22815/lot/171/six-pairs-of-menuki-one-pair-by-yasuchika-19th-century-18/

 

http://tetsugendo.com/GalleryMenuki.html

 

Excellent shakudo and gold menuki of spider devouring hornet/wasp.

Goto school menuki of spider and wasp. Seen on many Juyo sets of Goto kodogu, this is a very classic design.

 

My first thought is this design is pretty popular - second thought is pretty common.

[Infinite_Wisdumb]

Thanks @Spartancrest - did you do an image search or something? I need to learn how to do that with my pics

[Spartancrest]

12 minutes ago, Infinite_Wisdumb said:

did you do an image search or something?

It is all about asking the right questions - and having a computer that seems to know what you are after from years of experience - "ghost in the machine"

[Spartancrest]

A few more for good measure.

https://www.aoijapan.net/menuki-mumeiunsigned-spider/

 

https://www.pinterest.com.au/pin/312789136594341019/

 

What stands out to me is very little information on who or when they were made so it is back to square one.

[Spartancrest]

https://aucview.aucfan.com/yahoo/m1070851847/

 

 

https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/b285404825  This one is a tobacco pouch ornament.

 

 

This image from a 'Proxy' site very likely bogus so I won't add the link.

 

 

 

https://sword-auction.com/ja/product/6384/af17497-揃金具：無銘後藤-伝-栄乗-蜘蛛と蜂/   Goto attribution.

 

Try a search using these kanji - クモとハチの目貫

 

[Infinite_Wisdumb]

I had the same issue Dale.  Goto seems a common time.  No others so far that are just yamagane without shakudo that are of decent quality.  Wonder what the theme purpose is? "Hunter being hunted?"

 

[Bugyotsuji]

智勇兼備 The NBTHK paperwork above describes the menuki as Chi Yu Zu (design).

'Chi-Yu Ken Bi', the ideal warrior (or general) will have equal measures of both wisdom (spider?) and courage (wasp?).

 

They are also two of the 三徳 three virtues, wisdom, benevolence and courage. 

 

There is also a Buddhist story 'Kumohachi' which I have not researched yet.

[Infinite_Wisdumb]

8 minutes ago, Bugyotsuji said:

智勇兼備 The NBTHK paperwork above describes the menuki as Chi Yu Zu (design).

'Chi-Yu Ken Bi', the ideal warrior (or general) will have equal measures of both wisdom (spider?) and courage (wasp?).

 

They are also two of the 三徳 three virtues, wisdom, benevolence and courage. 

 

There is also a Buddhist story 'Kumohachi' which I have not researched yet.

Great stuff Piers, thanks!

[Infinite_Wisdumb]

Wondering if this is worth sending to shinsa.....