Tanobe Sayagaki translation please!

[Jord505]

Hey guys, i recently submitted my first ever sword to Tanobe, and it came back looking awesome! I'd love some help translating please! I know it is Ko Mihara Masanobu but I'd love to know exactly what is written. Thank you in advance!

[Mark]

Welcome Jord?  nice sword.

 

did you send it to him directly or through an agent? In the past i have used an agent and as they are actually handling the sword, and being fluent in Japanese and English they usually supply a translation as part pf their service.

 

Also i have had Markus Sesko help with translation on swords i purchased that already have sayagaki

[kissakai]

Due to how busy Markus is he may not do a translation

 

[Jord505]

17 hours ago, Mark said:

Welcome Jord?  nice sword.

 

did you send it to him directly or through an agent? In the past i have used an agent and as they are actually handling the sword, and being fluent in Japanese and English they usually supply a translation as part pf their service.

 

Also i have had Markus Sesko help with translation on swords i purchased that already have sayagaki

Ive used Kelly Schmidt for a few yahoo purchases, Pablo Kuntz is his exporter - who i was lucky enough to have handle the submission to tanobe.

 

Markus isn’t replying atm, i assume super busy.

[Shugyosha]

Hi Jordan,

SteveM on here is very good and has a handle on Tanobe Sensei's style. I'm sure if you wait a while he'll reply.

 

Would it be rude to ask for some pictures of the blade?

[Jord505]

2 hours ago, Shugyosha said:

Hi Jordan,

SteveM on here is very good and has a handle on Tanobe Sensei's style. I'm sure if you wait a while he'll reply.

 

Would it be rude to ask for some pictures of the blade?

Haven't taken any proper photos yet, but for sure soon!

[Bugyotsuji]

End of Nanboku Cho, I think I can see on the diagonal paperwork. Tanobe San says from same age as Masahiro. 

 

The saya can be translated but it takes quite a bit of time and organization, so throwing it out like that is pressure in spades. The other problem is that if someone does make the time commitment to sit down and carefully translate it for you, someone else might pop in before you, so there is that 'rushed' factor too! It's easier therefore to step back and let someone else do it!

 

That is why I always suggest asking for chunks, for example one line, or one sentence at a time! 

[SteveM]

Another mighty long sayagaki from Tanobe-sensei. I'm travelling now, so don't have the time to sit down and parse this. As Piers says it takes a bit of effort. Luckily the guys here should be able to sort this out. Nothing too tricky in it, apart from the pronunciations used.

[Bugyotsuji]

To get your ball rolling, and always willing to take corrections! 

 

In large brushwork:

備後の国三原正信 Bingo no Kuni, Mihara Masanobu

 

Continued down right side...

生に近く尻をつまみ無銘 Ubu ni chikaku, shiri wo tsumami = Amost ubu, with the shiri (nakago end) slightly shortened(?), Mumei, ...

[Jord505]

5 hours ago, Bugyotsuji said:

To get your ball rolling, and always willing to take corrections! 

 

In large brushwork:

備後の国三原正信 Bingo no Kuni, Mihara Masanobu

 

Continued down right side...

生に近く尻をつまみ無銘 Ubu ni chikaku, shiri wo tsumami = Amost ubu, with the shiri (nakago end) slightly shortened(?), Mumei, ...

I cant thank you enough for this!

 

I started at the bottom, as it seemed easier and smaller to start with - and all i understand is 卯暦 which i assume is year of the rabbit (2023), when tanobe signed it

[Bugyotsuji]

We can eat away at it in circles. 

 

Down the bottom in large writing it says 刃長弐尺参寸五分 Hacho ni shaku san sun go bu (Blade length 2 shaku 3 Sun 5 Bu), ...and the NBTHK paperwork adds to that 強 Kyo, meaning 'plus a tad' or 'very slightly longer than that'.

[Shugyosha]

@Jordan - that's a lovely blade, many thanks for sharing the photos.

 

Here's a bit more - I'm missing a couple of kanji:

古三原鍛 囗 也板目が肌立心二流レル肌囗二

Ko Mihara kitae (?) nari itame ga hadatachi gokoro ni nagareru hada (?) ni.

 

"Ko Mihara forging style is itame but tending towards hadatachi (standing out) with flowing hada".

 

Hopefully the missing kanji won't alter the sense of this too much and if anyone can supply the missing parts, I'd be most grateful.

 

[Bugyotsuji]

古三原鍛冶 Kaji (swordsmith)之 no itamé?

肌合 hada ai(?)

The writing is pretty faint! 😅 

[Gakusee]

22 minutes ago, Shugyosha said:

@Jordan - that's a lovely blade, many thanks for sharing the photos.

 

Here's a bit more - I'm missing a couple of kanji:

古三原鍛 囗 也板目が肌立心二流レル肌囗二

Ko Mihara kitae (?) nari itame ga hadatachi gokoro ni nagareru hada (?) ni.

 

"Ko Mihara forging style is itame but tending towards hadatachi (standing out) with flowing hada".

 

Hopefully the missing kanji won't alter the sense of this too much and if anyone can supply the missing parts, I'd be most grateful.

 

 

John, that is truly impressive! We need to make better use of your multitude of skills in our local To-ken dealings!

Extremely well done!

Best wishes

[Jord505]

At the bottom, 探山識 + kao - i believe is Tanzan signed this

[Shugyosha]

20 minutes ago, Gakusee said:

 

John, that is truly impressive! We need to make better use of your multitude of skills in our local To-ken dealings!

Extremely well done!

Best wishes

 

Thank you Michael, that's very kind and of course I'm always happy to be of service!

[Shugyosha]

27 minutes ago, Bugyotsuji said:

古三原鍛冶 Kaji (swordsmith)之 no itamé?

肌合 hada ai(?)

The writing is pretty faint! 😅 

 

Thanks Piers, I think you have it!

[Nobody]

I am very busy these days.

I only show the following characters.

 

備後國三原正信

 

生ブニ近ク尻ヲツマミ無銘而同工ノ所傳有之

正信ハ正廣ト同時代ノ古三原鍛冶也

板目ガ肌立心ニ流レル肌合ニ

穏和ナ小沸付ク直刃ヲ焼キ

帽子ガ先丸ク滝落トシ風ニ返ルナド

南北朝末葉明徳頃ノ同工ニ擬セラレ滋味豊也

 

刃長弐尺参寸五分

 

時在癸卯暦始和

探山識

[Nobody]

3 hours ago, Jord505 said:

At the bottom, 探山識 + kao - i believe is Tanzan signed this

 

Tanzan appraised.

[Jord505]

9 hours ago, Nobody said:

I am very busy these days.

I only show the following characters.

 

備後國三原正信

 

生ブニ近ク尻ヲツマミ無銘而同工ノ所傳有之

正信ハ正廣ト同時代ノ古三原鍛冶也

板目ガ肌立心ニ流レル肌合ニ

穏和ナ小沸付ク直刃ヲ焼キ

帽子ガ先丸ク滝落トシ風ニ返ルナド

南北朝末葉明徳頃ノ同工ニ擬セラレ滋味豊也

 

刃長弐尺参寸五分

 

時在癸卯暦始和

探山識

You are a legend mate, thank you!

[Bugyotsuji]

So there you have the first difficult reading, by Mr Moriyama Koichi.

The second reading by someone will be to turn that into modern Japanese.

The final step will be to turn it into a kind of semi-understandable English fruit cake, containing all the nuts and raisins of Japanese sword vocabulary. 

E.g.

Original cryptic code by Tanzan

1. 温和ナ小沸付ク直刃ヲ焼キ帽子ガ先丸ク (kind reading by Moriyama San)

2. 温和な小沸付く、直刃焼き、帽子が先丸く (modern Japanese)

3. Onwa na Konie (ga) tsuku, suguha (wo) yaki, boshi ga saki maruku, (modern Japanese Romanized)

4. ...it has gentle konie, with a forged/quenched suguha, and the boshi has a rounded tip... (glorious English fruitcake)

 

*Speaking strictly for myself here, Brian, I cannot see how paying our members for translations would work. Too fiddly! Most of us do it because we like the challenge and the learning experience. If we're too busy we can easily say so. I am in the middle of stuff right now, for example, so just popping in occasionally to help out a little is the best I can do.

 

A large body of classic translation though is a horse of a different colo(u)r, maybe too much to bite off in one chunk, and such should probably be sent off for an expert to work on, a professional job paid for on mutually-acceptable terms, behind the scenes.

[Jord505]

3 hours ago, Bugyotsuji said:

So there you have the first difficult reading, by Mr Moriyama Koichi.

The second reading by someone will be to turn that into modern Japanese.

The final step will be to turn it into a kind of semi-understandable English fruit cake, containing all the nuts and raisins of Japanese sword vocabulary. 

E.g.

Original cryptic code by Tanzan

1. 温和ナ小沸付ク直刃ヲ焼キ帽子ガ先丸ク (kind reading by Moriyama San)

2. 温和な小沸付く、直刃焼き、帽子が先丸く (modern Japanese)

3. Onwa na Konie (ga) tsuku, suguha (wo) yaki, boshi ga saki maruku, (modern Japanese Romanized)

4. ...it has gentle konie, with a forged/quenched suguha, and the boshi has a rounded tip... (glorious English fruitcake)

 

*Speaking strictly for myself here, Brian, I cannot see how paying our members for translations would work. Too fiddly! Most of us do it because we like the challenge and the learning experience. If we're too busy we can easily say so. I am in the middle of stuff right now, for example, so just popping in occasionally to help out a little is the best I can do.

 

A large body of classic translation though is a horse of a different colo(u)r, maybe too much to bite off in one chunk, and such should probably be sent off for an expert to work on, a professional job paid for on mutually-acceptable terms, behind the scenes.

I had the option to pay for a translation. But chipping away at translations, matching a mei to a smiths generation, scouring the internet for oshigata etc is the stuff i love about this hobby. 
 

i greatly appreciate all of you guys for turning tanobe’s handwriting into a form that i can now translate myself. I will update the thread with what i end up with when im done! Haha 

[Bugyotsuji]

Jordan, you have been tested and found acceptable. Plenty of guys come here and take offence at the smallest thing, but you have seen things with a positive and healthy enthusiasm. I salute you! 

[Jord505]

So i'm unsure of Japanese sentence structure; when to start a sentence and where it ends, but this is my first attempt. Please correct where you see errors guys!

 

備後國三原正信
Bingo Kuni Mihara Masanobu
 
生ブニ近ク尻ヲツマミ無銘而同工ノ所傳有之
almost ubu with the nakago end slightly shortened, mumei

 

正信ハ正廣ト同時代ノ古三原鍛冶也
Masanobu was from the same time period as Masahiro, Both legendary Ko Mihara kaji

 

板目ガ肌立心ニ流レル肌合ニ
forging style is itame but tending towards hadatachi (standing out) with flowing hada

 

穏和ナ小沸付ク直刃ヲ焼キ
Hamon is straight, with gentle Ko Nie

 

帽子ガ先丸ク滝落トシ風ニ返ルナド
The Boshi is a rounded Ko Maru, with a long Kaeri

 

南北朝末葉明徳頃ノ同工ニ擬セラレ滋味豊也
It was made at the end of the Nanbokucho period 
around the time of Meitoku(1390), and it is rich in flavor.

 

刃長弐尺参寸五分
Blade length 2 shaku, 3 Sun, 5 Bu

 

時在癸卯暦始和
At the beginning of mizunoto-u (year of rabbit 2023) 

 

探山識 + KAO
Tanzan (Tanobe Michihiro) Appraised
+Kao (Artistic Signature)

[Bugyotsuji]

Great job! 95/100

[SteveM]

Well done. Now that you've done all the hard work, let me try to polish it. 

 

Bingo Kuni Mihara Masanobu
 
Nearly ubu nakago, very slightly shortened. Mumei, but showing characteristics of this smith. Masanobu was a Ko-Mihara swordsmith, contemporary with Masaharu. The hamon is straight, with gentle ko-nie, with areas of pronounced itame hada. The bōshi is is rounded at the tip in "taki otoshi" style. This sword is from the Namboku-chō era, circa Meitoku (1390-1394), and is rich in all the characteristics one expects from this smith. 

 

The "taki otoshi" style is characteristic of Mihara smiths, and would be an important kantei point - so probably best to leave that as is. "Rich in flavor" doesn't really fit in with swords, and doesn't quite get across what Tanobe is trying to say (i.e. that even though the sword is mumei, its showing all the traits of a Ko-Mihara sword, and particularly those of Masanobu). In other words, he's saying the sword shows us everything we would expect to see in a Masanobu sword, and therefore it validates the appraisal. 

[Bugyotsuji]

Some small additions, Jordan, to Steve's admirable comments.

 

You used the word 'legendary' but it is not in the original text.

Usually we hear the phrase Hada 'tatsu' rather than tachi, although it would be understandable.

末葉 indicates 'the very ends' of something, the tips. Meitoku is the final three years before the beginning of Muromachi, so literally the dying embers or final moments of Namboku-Cho.

[Jord505]

love this s**t. you guys are so awesome!

[Jord505]