Blade id

[Steffieeee]

Hi would like some help to id age and any other info about this blade? It's very small and light, I'm guessing has been substantially shortened from the look of the tang. Thnx for any info. Overall length 71, nagasa 56 cms

[NewB]

Hello,

 

All I have is - beautiful sugata (curvature).

 

J.

[ChrisW]

Agreed! A shame it is now only wakizashi length. Is there any visible grain you can capture in a photo?

[NewB]

Something might be off either with my eyes or the measurements or the photos. Maybe measure again?

 

otherwise- High shinogi, koshi sori. Old

 

J.

[ChrisW]

2 minutes ago, Darkcon said:

Something might be off either with my eyes or the measurements or the photos. Maybe measure again?

 

otherwise- High shinogi, koshi sori. Old

 

J.

 

I had this same thought too with regards to the measurements given.

[PNSSHOGUN]

Perhaps a Sue Bizen Katate-uchi given the Nagasa and large Sori.

[NewB]

40 minutes ago, PNSSHOGUN said:

Perhaps a Sue Bizen Katate-uchi given the Nagasa and large Sori.

 

I own a bingo kai mihara blade with similar characteristics (not counting the nakago). This seems wider..

 

J.

[PNSSHOGUN]

This looks like the remnants of a Shumei, are you able to get closeup pics of this spot?

 

[NewB]

55 minutes ago, PNSSHOGUN said:

This looks like the remnants of a Shumei, are you able to get closeup pics of this spot?

 

 

 

Ditto!.. and then the copper filled mekugi anas.. Definitely worth showing to a pro!

 

J.

[Steffieeee]

6 hours ago, Darkcon said:

Something might be off either with my eyes or the measurements or the photos. Maybe measure again?

 

otherwise- High shinogi, koshi sori. Old

 

J.

Sadly the measurements are right, it's fairly small and lightweight more like a toothpick than a sword. Can't see any grain at all sadly but the hamon is clearly very visible. Thanks for the comments, so probably later muromachi period?

[NewB]

59 minutes ago, Steffieeee said:

Sadly the measurements are right, it's fairly small and lightweight more like a toothpick than a sword. Can't see any grain at all sadly but the hamon is clearly very visible. Thanks for the comments, so probably later muromachi period?

 

I have a 30" nagasa Kamakura blade that feels like a toothpick.. There's something about these old ones that the balance and weight just feels like the blade is an extension of your arm in a sense, where motion is just mindless rather than a tool you need to direct and control and fight with .. maybe because they were polished down so much.. I dont know - I love kamakura and nanbokucho periods, personally.

 

If you could take better photos of where that orange/red hue that looks like a Lacquer of your nakago along with thickness of the blade at the notch ((without the habaki) photos below)) and some photos of the tempered part where there's no obstruction of rust or scratches, some photos of the tip temper and hopefully capture some of the folded steel pattern above the temper then someone considerably more knowledgeable than me might chime in. I know, a lot to ask lots of light angle playing.

 

Last, i suggest that you please don't put the bare blade on a hard surface directly.

 

Cheers

 

J.

 

 

[ROKUJURO]

And Steff,

please show all photos with the tip upwards!

[vajo]

This picture is better for looking on the shape.

Nagasa 56 cm - really?

Looks like a boys tachi or something else.

 

Looks a little bit curious in my eyes but I'm not very good in such things so please forgive me when I'm wrong.

[NewB]

Ooo suriage right? That must have been a big boy to carry such a massive tachi.

 

I'm having a good feeling about this blade. Hopefully it is healthy enough 

 

 

J.

[vajo]

Strange shape for a tachi in my eyes. Looks "krum"

[NewB]

Picture quality

we are speculating over that, plus look at the photo you edited - the blade is lifted up unevenly. Imho That could be giving you that feeling 

 

j.

 

 

[DoTanuki yokai]

It’s Torizori in my opinion and if I imagine that it was once longer it becomes even more. 
But I don’t think it was much longer maybe 8cm and the lower Mekugiana is the first one this fits Katateuchi like John said. 
 

Edit:

[NewB]

You are right!

 

I stand corrected, thank you. I jumped the 🔫 

 

The extension of the hamon gave me a feeling for the ooo suriage. I could barely see file marks in the photo ..

 

 

[ROKUJURO]

When I saw the strong SORI, I immediately thought of the possibility of SAIHA as well.

[Utopianarian]

1 hour ago, ROKUJURO said:

When I saw the strong SORI, I immediately thought of the possibility of SAIHA as well.

I agree unnatural sori. I have an old blade as well that shows evidence of saiha which also is reflective in the sori.

[vajo]

2 hours ago, ROKUJURO said:

When I saw the strong SORI, I immediately thought of the possibility of SAIHA as well.

Is that the same as Yakinaoshi Jean?

[NewB]

 

 

J.

[ROKUJURO]

Yes Chris, correct!

 

Yakinaoshi (re-temper)
A report by Kurihara Hikosaburo Akihide
Translated material provided by nihontocraft.com

栗原彦三郎昭秀
Preface : This is a fascinating article about Kurihara Akihide's work and research in the field of re-tempering blades that lost their hamon due to fire. This process is called "saiha". From the stand point of those who study Nihonto, a saiha blade has little value because it no longer can be considered representative of the craftsman who originally made it. As collectors, we should certainly stay away from blades that have been re-tempered. However, it is interesting to note that from the stand point of a blade's functional purpose, a sword can be made useful again by this process. It is also enlightening to learn that the work of certain smiths performed with a high degree of excellence after saiha. I think this speaks highly of both Akihide and the smiths that made these blades.....
 

[Steffieeee]

7 hours ago, vajo said:

Strange shape for a tachi in my eyes. Looks "krum"

I don't really understand what any of the above comments means to be honest. Must look at my terminology book. Saiha is re-tempering, how does that relate to blade shape or curvature?

 

Ok I have been reading about this now on the forum and understand. So I can assume the curvature is not original, the hamon is not original and there is no way of knowing what the sword is or how old at all?

[DoTanuki yokai]

We are just some guys looking on pictures, I think their is a good chance we are wrong. 
 

Also “Krum” is German and is used for a curvature that is not intended or come from an accident/damage. 
 

Get it to a qualified polisher and then to shinsa if you really want to know what it is.  

[John C]

1 hour ago, Steffieeee said:

Saiha is re-tempering, how does that relate to blade shape or curvature?

STEFd:

Just as a point of interest, Japanese blades are generally quenched in water straight. It's the differential cooling from the applied clay that causes the curvature. Now, if the blade were caught in a fire (which was fairly common) it could lose its temper and become softer. The blade then needs to be re-hardened, which changes the shape.

Hope that helps explain it a little.

John C. 

[David Flynn]

This is Torii Zori not Koshizori.

[Mark S.]

Suriage and a pretty substantial machi-okuri?