Dereks Posted January 3, 2023 Report Posted January 3, 2023 Hi guys, I was passing by a garage sale today and noticed a sword. Seller, an old British lady, told me Japanese gifted this to her father and was very dear to him. It didn’t have any papers or signature so it was a bargain and would be foolish not to risk it so I bought it. Have a couple questions..is it hand made or machine made in war? if handmade, how old do you think? It has a hamon but very thin, not like wavily like others I’ve been seeing. Also got a medal as a gift. I will upload a video and some pictures in a minute. Thanks a lot. https://streamable.com/c5u2w9 2 1 Quote
Ray Singer Posted January 3, 2023 Report Posted January 3, 2023 Congratulations. It appears to be an ubu (unshortened) Shinto blade. Please show the nakago (tang) clearly though. No question on authenticity. Nice quality and an exceptional find from a garage sale. Congratulations. Don't do anything to improve the condition beyond what it is now, just keep oiled to maintain the condition and enjoy your study. Best regards, Ray 2 Quote
Rivkin Posted January 3, 2023 Report Posted January 3, 2023 I have to admit having some difficulty understanding the blade.. can we see the boshi and nakago in detail? In video I think there is a glimpse of darkish hue (somewhat ugly "utsuri") around the ha; the patchy-large nie arranged in "belts"... Sugata which can be shinto, but I personally would not exclude late Muromachi. Somewhat rough jigane with masame. Its hard to judge here, but it can be late Muromachi Uda... 2 Quote
Okan Posted January 3, 2023 Report Posted January 3, 2023 Wow great find Derek. You are very lucky! As everyone said, you have to show the nakago(tang). Use a soft light so we can also see the color of the rust. I have a feeling this might be an old blade. I want to say early to mid Muromachi but being ubu, it doesn’t make sense. Confusing blade. More pictures please!! 1 Quote
Dereks Posted January 3, 2023 Author Report Posted January 3, 2023 Thank you Darkcon, Ray Singer, Rivkin and Okan. Rivkin, I'm using google to translate each word you said I'm gonna share new pictures in 5. 1 Quote
Dereks Posted January 3, 2023 Author Report Posted January 3, 2023 Here are some more pictures: @Ray Singer@Rivkin@Okan@Darkcon Appreciate your help! 1 Quote
Ray Singer Posted January 3, 2023 Report Posted January 3, 2023 Like very different from what I thought from the first photo. Nakago looked rounded at the bottom. This looks osuriage mumei. Likely a koto blade (made before the Edo period). 2 Quote
Dereks Posted January 3, 2023 Author Report Posted January 3, 2023 On 1/3/2023 at 11:17 PM, Ray Singer said: Like very different from what I thought from the first photo. Nakago looked rounded at the bottom. This looks osuriage mumei. Likely a koto blade (made before the Edo period). Expand Thank you Ray! It must be the shadow I presume. So osuriage mumei is inferior to ubu? Quote
Ray Singer Posted January 3, 2023 Report Posted January 3, 2023 Many koto blades are osuriage mumei. Ubu have a higher market value, however I'll stress again that this is a nice sword. 1 Quote
Nobody Posted January 3, 2023 Report Posted January 3, 2023 As for the medal, Ref. Victory Medal (Japan) - Wikipedia 4 Quote
Rivkin Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 Looks quite possibly late Muromachi. No way to be sure with these photographs, but I think it can be sue Tegai or something similar. 1 Quote
Ooitame Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 Congratularions, looks like a nice find! Agree with Ray, on all points 1 1 Quote
Shugyosha Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 Nice find Derek. Not a bit jealous. 1 Quote
Okan Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 Derek, I have to agree with Rivkin. This is probably a Yamato blade. Take good care of it. Buy nice flowers to that old lady(and maybe some jewellery).. 1 Quote
Tom Darling Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 Appears to be, maybe koto, maybe an ubu shinto of a koto blade. Many osuriage bl;ades are actually ubu as the kaji made it in the shape of a koto period blade. Very nice sword indeed. Good luck. Tom Quote
vajo Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 Very nice koto sword with suguha-ba hamon. The ara nie (black martensit spots) looks very nice. The sword is in great condition. Just lovely. could be a shortend tachi? As for the age Derek. It's minimum 400 years old. Nearly the same age as Jamestown was founded 2 1 Quote
Tom Darling Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 The first garage sale find as I recall some 40 yrs ago was a NT tachi out of Michigan. I heard of several others that came out of Michigan. 1 Quote
Franco Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 Not convinced this is a koto sword, yet. Overall length? Cutting edge length? Sori? Moto-haba? Saki-haba? Moto-kasane, Saki-kasane? Quote
Ray Singer Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 On 1/4/2023 at 6:39 PM, Tom Darling said: The first garage sale find as I recall some 40 yrs ago was a NT tachi out of Michigan. I heard of several others that came out of Michigan. Expand The article from Jim Kurrasch: A tachi signed Tomomura. It was designated Jūyō Bunkasai on September 24th, 1941, and is 2 shaku, 6 sun, 2 bu long – 79.4 cm. The owner the Sahara Hachimangu Shrine submitted this to the Oita Prefecture Police on January 19th, 1946. They turned it over to the Occupying Forces. These Forces were only remembered by a red arrow marking, so they may have been the 32nd. Field Artillery Battalion. The JB set # is 401, and the Yamanaka # is 25. It is also pictured in the book Koto Henby on page 27. Harry AFU Watson later translated this book into english. This blade was found about 1994. A man visited a yard sale in Detroit, Michigan. There he asked if they had any swords for sale. The sellers entered the house, and returned with a fully mounted tachi. They said that the wife (of Japanese decent), had been given this by a former boyfriend. The yard sale was so they could return to California, so that may have been where she had been given this blade. This couple wanted $75 for the blade. The buyer offered $50, and they settled on $60. The buyer did not collect Nihontō so he took it to a friend who did. That friend offered him $300. The new owner figured it was worth far more than that. So he lost a friend and took it to a sword show. A friend of mine was at that show, and was offered it. He and another headed off to get more money. By the time they returned the price had quadrupled. It was finally sold in the new owners living room, with a California / Japanese dealer (in the room) beating out a Japanese dealer on the phone. The final price was $100,000 and a Rolex watch. 3 3 Quote
Franco Posted January 4, 2023 Report Posted January 4, 2023 On 1/4/2023 at 7:51 PM, Ray Singer said: The article from Jim Kurrasch: Expand This is the story that two friends attending that show as well recounted. Quote
Dereks Posted January 4, 2023 Author Report Posted January 4, 2023 Thanks everyone for the answers. I really appreciate it. @Franco D the swords overall length is 79cm 64cm from edge moto haba 2.70cm tip is 1.8cm width is 0.45cm 552 gram weight 2 Quote
Bugyotsuji Posted January 7, 2023 Report Posted January 7, 2023 Thank you Moriyama San. The Taisho 9 medal shows France, Italy, Japan, America and Britain on the front, but although it is Japanese, it seems to be written with a Chinese style of calligraphy. Quote
Nobody Posted January 7, 2023 Report Posted January 7, 2023 On 1/7/2023 at 9:10 AM, Bugyotsuji said: Thank you Moriyama San. The Taisho 9 medal shows France, Italy, Japan, America and Britain on the front, but although it is Japanese, it seems to be written with a Chinese style of calligraphy. Expand Kanji in such a style were used in Japan until just after WWII. Ref. Shinjitai - Wikipedia 2 Quote
Bugyotsuji Posted January 7, 2023 Report Posted January 7, 2023 Ah, thank you, I was looking at a similar but slightly different one on Wiki! Quote
reeder Posted January 8, 2023 Report Posted January 8, 2023 You could submit it to shinsa at the April Chicago sword show as is. If it got a nice attribution and/or rating in Chicago you could consider restoring and submitting to NBTHK in Japan. Quote
Mark Posted January 8, 2023 Report Posted January 8, 2023 Ray i remember that story, Detroit is just up the road from me. I know the guy who bought it, see him a few times a year. 1 Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.