A Request for Translation ,but Please Don't Cry

[drac2k]

I know many of you will shudder when you see this broken blade and ask why I could possibly want to waste anyone's time for a translation, but I have a plan.

I am going to go to a knife maker whom I know and I will ask him to repoint it & sharpen the blade; unfortunately I will probable loose the temper line. I will next have him make a handle out of clear plexiglass(in the WW2 Theater Knife Tradition ),to allow the signatures to be seen. This I am doing for myself and not to be sold(the cost of this would probably exceed what I could sell it for),and in a sense a blade could come back to life, which I think the original sword maker would appreciate.

[NewB]

👋 

 

If I'm not mistaken it is Kanemichi with a Seki stamp. I'm still learning so the date I'd leave to someone else with more knowledge. Definitely a 1940s blade, I assume 

 

Cheers

 

J.

[xiayang]

Looks more like 兼逹 = Kanetatsu, I believe.

 

It’s dated 昭和十七年 = Shōwa 17 (1942 CE).

[NewB]

24 minutes ago, xiayang said:

Looks more like 兼逹 = Kanetatsu, I believe.

 

It’s dated 昭和十七年 = Shōwa 17 (1942 CE).

 

Thank you for the correction 

 

J.

[drac2k]

Thanks to all !

[ROKUJURO]

David,

if a knifemaker was to transform this into a knife, I am afraid he would have to trim the NAKAGO down to a fitting size for one hand. 

To keep the YAKIBA intact at the point, you could ask him to make a Seax point (Viking type).

[drac2k]

Last point first; the idea of a seax is a great one and certainly worthy of consideration. I would love to keep the  Yakiba.

I have been going back and forth about keeping its original length, as opposed to shorting it. I think that shortening the tang wouldn't be out of the tradition of Japanese sword makers of which I have several examples of the Nakago being cut ,i.e. a katana made into a wakizashi .

[Jacques D.]

Quote

To keep the YAKIBA intact at the point, you could ask him to make a Seax point (Viking type).

 

This is called Satsuma-age

[Bugyotsuji]

David, keep us posted on your progress! 

[Dave R]

Or you could stay within tradition, a blade treated like this actually papered some years ago.  http://www.ksky.ne.jp/~sumie99/suriage.html

[Brian]

Guys, it's a ruined arsenal mass produced oil quenched Gunto that was likely cut into pieces because it's not traditionally made. The entire blade length is about 10cm now.
Let's not get carried away.
Go mad, you can't ruin it. But you also can't save it.

[ROKUJURO]

Brian, 

the allowed blade length in Japan is 150 mm, so confiscated blades are usually cut that long. I think there remains enough material to make a useful outdoor knife from the 'ruins'. Nothing wrong with the steel for that purpose in my opinion.

[ROKUJURO]

2 hours ago, Jacques D. said:

This is called Satsuma-age

Thank you Jacques! I forgot the term.

[Brian]

Correct. But that would have nothing to do with Japanese swords and it would have to be drastically reshaped. It would make a decent homemade knife project. But as Nihonto, this does not apply and never will.

 

[robinalexander]

Well it's lucky that David (Virginia) only wishes to make a knife and therefore preserve, in a practical sense, what little is left of Kanetatsu's work. I don't think David OP mentioned anything about Nihonto. 

 

Nice one David.

Rob

 

 

[Bruce Pennington]

Somebody give Brian a chill-pill. Ha!  The guy's just trying to do something fun, while preserving what is still to many of us a piece of history that represents the blood, sweat, and tears of craftsmen and soldiers.  I like what David!  Keep us updated.

 

Oh, and thanks for the Seki-stamped photos for the files!  Yours is only the 3rd Kanetatsu I now have on file.

[drac2k]

Thanks guys for all of your support and great ideas! I think most of you understand what I'm trying to do and several people have summarized it perfectly. Rokujuro's idea of a seax got me thinking and I like the last picture of  David R's diagram. The blade length is 20 cm.

I will carry it to a local gun show November 25th and discuss it with the knife maker and advise the forum of my progress after that.

[drac2k]

I Just wanted to update everyone on the knife project; unfortunately I got the flu, and I had to give up my 2 tables at the show. I will try to reattempt in January

[John C]

Too bad about the flu. I was interested in the project. When making the decision, remember there is a practical reason for the shape indicated by Dave R.'s diagram. Generally, only the edge is hardened steel (hence the hamon). Any other shape would introduce mild, soft, core, or unhardened steel to the tip. That's assuming, of course, you did not want to re-harden and temper the blade.

 

John C.

[drac2k]

Thanks John; yes it was disappointing. I have decided to go with one of David's variations, probably the last illustration for the blade. I've been messing around with a couple of ideas for a guard under the habaki in a more Western style, while keeping a traditional handle.

[drac2k]

Update; the blade is with the knifemaker and it will be picked up and posted by the end of April.

[ROKUJURO]

David,

thanks for the update; seems we are a bit curious!

Please do not let the knifemaker shape it too pointy. This will make it a stabbing weapon which would be perfect for a serial killer but of not much use in other fields.

[drac2k]

I think many will find the modifications interesting; I operated within the confines of keeping the full tang length, not adding any holes and keeping as much of the temper line as possible. I dare not say more without giving it away before I can unveil it, however I do think it would made a great stabbing weapon for a serial killer, but not in the shape one might imagine.

[Stephen]

Just seen his thread I'm hoping a camp knife my friend and not anything to fantasy related.

But to each his own at least it's getting repurposed looking forward to photos.

[John C]

13 hours ago, drac2k said:

however I do think it would made a great stabbing weapon for a serial killer

David:

Dare I ask how you would know this?

John C.

[drac2k]

Now that is funny! The answer is watching too many hours of Netflix! Hint, I reconfigured the item as a weapon as it was originally meant to be and not to be used as an everyday knife.

[Stephen]

12 hours ago, Stephen said:

not anything to fantasy related.

Oh well 😂

[Shugyosha]

On 10/28/2022 at 10:58 PM, ROKUJURO said:

David,

if a knifemaker was to transform this into a knife, I am afraid he would have to trim the NAKAGO down to a fitting size for one hand. 

To keep the YAKIBA intact at the point, you could ask him to make a Seax point (Viking type).

Nice Seax! Sorry Jean, but how does the Viking seax differ from the Saxon version? 👍👍

[drac2k]

I dare not say more, as I don't want to give it away before I post the pictures prior to receiving it in April.

[ROKUJURO]

2 hours ago, Shugyosha said:

.....how does the Viking seax differ from the Saxon version? 👍👍

John, generally, seax had a very wide variety of forms. This had to do with the ethnics of the makers as well as the area of use and the times. Seaxes were in use from the Danube to northern Scandinavia, and not only Saxons and Vikings used them but also Germanic tribes. The Anglo-Saxons on the 'tin-islands' were those who used it the longest time - up to about the year 1.000! 

The seax in the photo above is a broad seax with a 'broken neck' shape of the tip, but there were many other versions in use (see below a 'willow leaf' blade). 
Some were found in graves with a length of up to 90 cm and a MOTO KASANE of 12 mm!