Motohaba of swords

[Paz]

Hi all just a quick question regarding the width / motohaba of certain swords. 

 

Was the width/motohaba of swords determined by school, period, or combination of both ? Or is it random depending on smith. Personally I prefer wide blades. I've also noticed gendai blades seem to come with more width /motohaba, with the little experience I have of them. 

 

What I've noticed is that some blades ive owened from muromachi are standard motohaba of around 2.5-8. , shinto blades of 3cm and above. One sword I've recently purchased has motohaba of 3.3cm. 

I own shortend muromachi blade but It has quite thin motohaba, which strikes me as this sword was made during conflict. 

 

 

Thanks 

 

 

[Jussi Ekholm]

I do have lots and lots of data of pre-1500 swords as that is my focus. Unfortunately I have skipped on the later stuff as I don't have time for everything.

 

Most common range for surviving motohaba of ubu tachi of pre-1500 is from 2,8 cm to 3,2 cm. Anything over 3,2 cm width I would consider wide and tachi under 2,8 cm I would see as narrow. While the era and tradition have their stereotypical standards, there is also often lot of variation among the surviving works of smiths.

 

I really like researching Bizen stuff as they have so many dated example compared to other regions.

 

You could often say that late Heian / early Kamakura period tachi would stereotypically be more narrow. However there are of course outliers Ko-Bizen Masatsune has Jūyō Bunkazai tachi with 3,4 cm motohaba and Tomonari has the small ōdachi with 3,3 cm motohaba. And in comparison both smiths have ubu tachi that are 2,5 - 2,7 cm remaining at base (I will exclude one very narrow in case source books have measurement mistake). Famous Ō-Kanehira is 3,6 cm motohaba and while other Kanehira items I have info on are sub-3,0 cm. There are some other Ko-Bizen works that are still 3,3 - 3,5 cm in motohaba and you can find comparable items that are 2,5 - 2,7 cm in motohaba.

 

I would say the similar trend continues during Kamakura period and following into early Nanbokuchō. Ichimonji - Osafune - Hatakeda etc. Now when you research ōdachi that are very dear to me, you start to get into wide items. However unfortunately very few Nanbokuchō and Muromachi period ōdachi survive in original length.

For example for the famous smith Kanemitsu there is 88,8 cm ubu tachi that is 3,6 cm motohaba (unfortunately I don't have width for the 103,9 cm ōdachi) and for comparison 73,9 cm tachi with 2,7 cm motohaba. The famous ōdachi by Tomomitsu is 126,0 cm and 4,4 cm motohaba, 82,0 cm tachi with 3,5 cm and 73,5 cm with 2,9 cm. For Kozori Hidemitsu there is 81,6 cm tachi with 3,7 cm motohaba and 74,5 with 3,0 cm. When you get into Ōei there are few wide ones by Yasumitsu, widest being 108,2 cm ōdachi at 3,5 cm. Then for comparison not all long tachi are very wide as Yasumitsu has 86,1 cm tachi that is 3,0 cm motohaba.

 

This may be bit difficult post to catch on but I tried to show with examples that surviving very wide old blades are extremely rare and they are often very long too. Likewise it is very easy to encounter both fairly wide and fairly narrow surviving items by many smiths. But the reality is the vast majority of the thousands of tachi I have info on fall between the average scope.

[ROKUJURO]

The MIHABA of older (= KOTO) blades is in my opinion also much dependent on the number of polishes they have 'suffered' over the centuries. There may be some rare swords that have not lost so much material, but I think most blades have been polished multiple times so that we cannot be sure about their original MIHABA.

[Paz]

So in terms of polishing this may provide why were more likely to see wider blades in the later parts of shinshinto and gendai. As less need for polish. 

 

Thanks 

[Jean]

II think that Nambokucho is likely to have the largest Mihaba.

 

ODENTA (Miike school) national treasure has a motohaba of 3,33 cm

 

Motohaba of my former Osuriage Nambokucho Tametsugu is 3,2cm

[Jacques]

Keep in mind that the size of the motohaba is a current measurement and not the one from the time the sword was forged. The number of polishings matters even if the difference is not more than a millimeter or two. I speak of course for a ubu sword.  

 

I own a Rai Kinmichi wakizashi with a 3.3 cm motohaba and a 55 cm nagasa and it has been polished several times.