Translation help on Additional Kanji on Masanaga Gendaito

[matthewbrice]

Hello.  I could use some help with the extra kanji on this sword if someone has time to take a look.  

 

Thank you!

 

 

 

 

--Matt

 

 

[Kiipu]

七生刀鍛錬道場.

 

Matt, I have run into this marking before on a Masakatsu 正勝.

Katana [Nakamura Masakatsu]

 

Edit:  I remember now that the Masakatsu had Arabic numbers stamped on the nakago mune.  Another Masakatsu had a faint 阪 final inspection mark on it.  Does your 正永 have a number stamped on the nakago mune or a 阪 inspection mark?

Sword Forge At Inari Shrine Kyoto

A Study: Minatogawa-to

@Bruce Pennington

[matthewbrice]

Hi Thomas.  Thank you for the translation help!  Using Google translate, it appears that 七生刀鍛錬道場 translates to Nanao Sword Training Dojo.  Is that what you read, Thomas?  

 

As to your question, yes, I just looked at the mune.  The arabic number '17' is stamped there.  I have attached a photo.

 

Thank you for your help, Thomas!

 

 

 

--Matt Brice

 

  

[Kiipu]

Hi Matt, I have not looked into these nor made a file folder for them.  It does seem they are serialized on the nakago mune.  See the Masanaga 正永, serial 21, at the link below.

北武备-三式七生 正永（极特殊）

@BANGBANGSAN Does the Chinese text have anything to say about 七生刀鍛錬道場?

 

These swords seems to have some sort of association with Kusunoki Masashige 楠木正成 and the Minatogawa Shrine 湊川神社.  There is a monograph on the Minatogawa Shrine swords; alas, I do not own a copy.  Maybe someone reading this will have a copy and can take a look to see if 七生刀鍛錬道場 is mentioned or not.

Wallinga, Herman A. Gendaito Made at the Minatogawa Shrine. 2000. [35 pages.]

 

七生 = Shichishō = 7 lives [possibly related to 七生報國 by Kusunoki Masashige]

@SteveM is that the right rōmaji ローマ字?

[SteveM]

Yes, Shichishō, and yes I would also guess this is from Shichishō Hōkoku, or an allusion to it.

"Seven lives dedicated to country" is the literal translation, but it means no matter how many times I'm reborn, i will still give up my life for my country. 

 

I couldn't find anything relating to a "Seven Lives Sword Foundry/Smithy" either, but I did find two or three other swords with this particular location name, so I will be keen to know if anyone has any information out there. Seems like there should be some data on it somewhere. 

[Kiipu]

On 12/25/2008 at 7:28 AM, hemi-man said:

Dear Moriyama San: I am assuming that Ito Masanaga and Ito Kishinaga are the same smith.  (After reading description of sword offered back when by JSA auction)  One mei was used at Minatogawa Jinga and the other at Shichisei to which was used by Minatogawa smiths to make special order swords on their "off time".  Any information on Shichisei-to will be greatly appreciated.  It was also in Kobe and as I understand, right on the river near Minatogawa Jinga?  Any and all help appreciated.

 

Since posting, I ran across this 2008 post by @hemi-man that can be seen above after editing.  The reference to shichisei is just another way of saying shichishō 七生.

[Bruce Pennington]

Matt, is there no date on this Masakatsu?

 

I find it interesting that this, and the other "60" linked by Thomas, are not star-stamped.  However, I do have several star-stamped blades with numbers on the mune, and I haven't studied the significance.  I have a star-stamped Masakatsu, April '45, with "1512" stamped on the face of the nakago. 

 

Harumph.... more work to do!

[BANGBANGSAN]

14 hours ago, Kiipu said:

Hi Matt, I have not looked into these nor made a file folder for them.  It does seem they are serialized on the nakago mune.  See the Masanaga 正永, serial 21, at the link below.

北武备-三式七生 正永（极特殊）

@BANGBANGSAN Does the Chinese text have anything to say about 七生刀鍛錬道場?

 

The guy who sell that sword asked me about 正永 and 七生刀鍛錬道場 as well.

Here is what I found out for him,

正永 Masunaga, whose real name is 伊藤岸永 Ito Kishinaga, was a 授命刀匠 work for both the army and navy and lived near the 湊川神社 Minatogawa Shrine. He used 正清 Masaaki mei when he made naval orders at Minatogawa Shrine. The 七生刀鍛煉道場 is a sword forging workshop near Minatogawa Shrine, where the 授命刀匠 are allowed to make special-order swords in their spare time. The Mei he used  in the 七生刀鍛煉道場 is 正永 Masunaga.

 

[SteveM]

10 hours ago, BANGBANGSAN said:

The 七生刀鍛煉道場 is a sword forging workshop near Minatogawa Shrine

 

This makes sense, as the Minatogawa Shrine is dedicated to Kusunoki Masashige, who was the samurai associated with the phrase "Shichishō Hōkoku", having said it just before a dramatic, heroic, but ultimately fatal last stand against Ashikaga forces.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kusunoki_Masashige

[matthewbrice]

Hi Bruce.  Yes, it is dated.  I have attached a photo.  

 

 

 

--Matt

 

www.StCroixBlades.com

[Kiipu]

昭和十八年十月日 = A day in October 1943.

[matthewbrice]

You have all been so helpful.  Thank you!

 

Ok, so to summarize, Tosho smiths who worked at the Minatogawa Shrine when making Naval swords worked at a nearby forge to fulfill special orders.  This nearby forge was called 'Seven Lives' Forge?  Or was the forge called 'Seven Lives Dedicated to Country' forge?  I certainly may not have this correct--so seeking a clarification if you guys can weigh in.  

 

Thanks again gentlemen!

 

 

 

--Matt

 

[BANGBANGSAN]

4 hours ago, matthewbrice said:

This nearby forge was called 'Seven Lives' Forge? 

 

 

 

 

 

Seven Lives sword forge （workshop)

[matthewbrice]

If anyone would like to see the other pictures of this sword, here is the link:

 

https://stcroixblades.com/shop/products/masanagajapanese-ww2-samurai-army-sword-1944-mounts-type-3-gendai-ties-to-m/

 

 

 

—Matt

[matthewbrice]

Thank you Trystan.  ☝️
 

 

 

—Matt

[Kiipu]

I asked Nick Komiya whether the character 刀 is a suffix of 七生-刀 or if it is a prefix for 刀-鍛錬.  In addition, I was confused by the use of the term dōjō 道場 which I associate with a place for martial arts training and not sword production.  Nick's reply can be seen in the post below.  I have added the rōmaji pronunciation for the kanji in brackets and the kana characters in parentheses so as to avoid others having to look it up.  I realize it is a bit unsightly and detracts from the flow; but, it gets the job done.

[Kiipu]

七生刀鍛錬道場

Shichishō Katana Tanrendōjō

By Nick Komiya

 

刀 [katana] is a prefix for 鍛錬 [tanren].  So it is read シチショウ　カタナ　タンレンドウジョウ (Shichishō Katana Tanrendōjō).

 

道場 [dōjō] is a place where you practice and learn all forms of ドウ [dō], not only martial arts, but also calligraphy (ショドウ shodō), flower arrangement (カドウ kadō) or tea ceremony (サドウ sadō) are all categorized as an art form of ドウ [dō].  ドウジョウ [dōjō] can also be a training course that is very intensive, used like 日本語道場 [Nihongo dōjō].

 

In this case of 刀鍛錬道場, the ドウジョウ (dōjō) is being described as a place or training course to practice タンレンドウ (tanrendō).

[matthewbrice]

Hi Thomas.  All I had available to me as a non-Japanese language speaker was google translate.   The translation I received there was:  Nanao Sword Training Dojo.  

 

So reconciling with the Seven Lives Forge alternative explanation--the inscription either refers to Seven Lives Forge...or, to the Nanao Sword Training Dojo?  If the inscription does refer to the sword dojo--was the sword likely made as a Special Order for the sword training dojo?  

 

 

 

--Matt

 

[Kiipu]

Matt, your sword is an army contract sword made by the Seven Lives Sword Forging Dōjō.  If you look carefully, usually between the characters 生 and 刀, you will find a faint "star" stamp or a 阪 final inspection mark.  One or the other marking has been reported on all Type 100s made so far by this dōjō.  To date, only these Type 100s have been reported to have a serial number on the nakago mune.

 

Besides the army contract, this dōjō undertook custom work.  For example, see the Masanaga 正永 swords depicted at the links below.

Minatogawa 1945

MINATOGAWA SHRINE SWORDS

 

The oldest reference I have run across so far is the description over at RiceCracker.com.

Katana - Masanaga (Ito Masakiyo)

[Kiipu]

On 7/17/2022 at 8:14 AM, matthewbrice said:

As to your question, yes, I just looked at the mune.  The arabic number '17' is stamped there.

 

After looking at all the others, I think the serial number could be 41.  Can you double check that for me?

 

The other serials that I have are 21, 60, and 94 ranging from September 1943 to March 1944.  Production at the dōjō would have stopped either in March 1945 or June 1945 because of bombing.

[Bruce Pennington]

3 hours ago, Kiipu said:

I think the serial number could be 41.

Bingo!  After zooming in, I agree!  It's still out of sequence, by date, but a bit closer to the 60 in March 1943.

 

At the risk of an off-topic rabbit chase, can you help me un-muddle my files?  I have some labeled Masanaga and some Masakatsu.  I cannot find an official mei of Masanaga, but the Nihontoclub has an ancient mei using "....正永" which seems to be what we are calling Masakatsu.  Also, among the Masanaga and Masakatsu files I have, there is a different second kanji (which I cannot replicate here, but here's a photo:

 

 

There is an Ito Masanaga listed on the RJT list, but no oshigata on file for comparison.

[Bruce Pennington]

And RIGHT after posting this clarification question, I stumbled across this post by @Jon MB HERE with a mei using the 正永 kanji, but called Masanaga!

[mecox]

Here's a bit more on the Minatogawa Shrine:

Minatogawa Jinja Kikusui Forge. The Minatogawa Shinto Shrine was built in 1872 to honour the devotion to the Emperor of army commander Kusunoki Masashige 楠正成 at a battle in 1336 at what was the Minato River, and is now in the western part of Kobe City. The Kikusui mon (chrysanthemum floating on water) his family mon, was later adopted by the shrine and also the Imperial Navy. A version was used on Minatogawa swords. In 1940 the Kikusui Tan-to Kai (Kikusui Sword Forging Association) was formed with an aim to produce Nihonto dedicated to the shrine and for naval officers. A dedication and forging ceremony was conducted on 25 December, 1940 (Showa 15). Around 12 months later, on 2 December, 1941 the forge was moved to a Egeyama, a hill about 1 km to the west (now a bushland park). The dedication and forging ceremony was repeated on 8 December, 1941 (Japan time); Japan declared war on US and UK the same day (7 December US time) one hour after Pearl Harbour was attacked. The shrine was active during the war but was destroyed by fire during an air raid on 17 March, 1945 and was rebuilt post-war; it was dedicated on 20 December, 1950. Traditionally made swords were produced at Kikusui from the end of 1940 to the surrender in August, 1945, but there appears to be a period when tanto were made in place of tachi. These gendaito were for Naval Officers and were largely distributed through the Naval Officers Club. Presumably the forge had supplies of tamahagane, or a substitute. On the nakago the “Kikusui mon” (chrysanthemum flower on water) was engraved above the mei (however, it is not clear if this was only for blades produced at the shrine).

[Bruce Pennington]

Ok, the plot thickens.  The Japaneseswordindex.com calls this Kanji - 勝 - katsu, and calls this kanji - 永 - naga.  So I'm totally confused.

 

We are calling the mei on OP's post Masakatsu, but that would be 正 勝 and Masanaga should be 正永.

 

Edit: I just checked Sesko's book and he backs this up.  He says

MASAKATSU (正勝),

and

MASANAGA (正永),

 

Edit #2:

Dang.....after re-reading Thomas' first post, I realize he was simply stating he had seen a similar marking ON a Masakatsu.  In haste, I thought he was saying Matt's blade WAS a Masakatsu.  *sigh*.  Sorry for all the confusion.  But the good side is now I can un-muddle my own files!!!

 

Pretend I wasn't here tonight......

[Bruce Pennington]

4 hours ago, Kiipu said:

21, 60, and 94

One more thing, Thomas, can you check your "60"?  The only 60 I have on file, after un-muddling them!, is a Masakatsu, Mar 1943, no star, 60 on mune.

[ROKUJURO]

On 7/18/2022 at 1:56 PM, BANGBANGSAN said:

The guy who sells that sword asked me about 正永 and 七生刀鍛錬道場 as well.

Here is what I found out for him,

正永 Masunaga MASANAGA, whose real name is 伊藤岸永 Ito Kishinaga, was a 授命刀匠 working for both the army and navy and lived near the 湊川神社 Minatogawa Shrine. He used 正清 Masaaki mei when he made naval orders at Minatogawa Shrine. The 七生刀鍛煉道場 is a sword forging workshop near Minatogawa Shrine, where the 授命刀匠 are allowed to make special-order swords in their spare time. The Mei he used  in the 七生刀鍛煉道場 is 正永 Masunaga MASANAGA.

 

[BANGBANGSAN]

4 hours ago, ROKUJURO said:

 

Thanks for correct MASU to MASA

[Kiipu]

10 hours ago, Bruce Pennington said:

Pretend I wasn't here tonight......

 

Never heard of the guy!  All of the 七生刀鍛錬道場 swords with the exception of one have been made by Masanaga.  The sole exception is a Masakatsu 正勝.

Masanaga = 正永.  (Or Masunaga if your name is Trystan!)

Masakatsu = 正勝.

 

9 hours ago, Bruce Pennington said:

The only 60 I have on file is a Masakatsu, Mar 1943, no star, 60 on mune.

 

It is actually dated March 1944 and not March 1943.  It is the only Seven Lives Type 100 with the 阪 final inspection mark instead of a "star" stamp.  The 阪 final inspection mark is between the characters 生 and 刀.  The 阪 final inspection mark is lightly struck and is large in size.  The link below says Masakatsu's 正勝 real name is 中村･勝.

Katana[Nakamura_Masakatsu]

[BANGBANGSAN]

47 minutes ago, Kiipu said:

 

It is the only Seven Lives Type 100 with the 阪 final inspection mark instead of a "star" stamp. 

Well, it seems more than one 7 lives RS with the 版 mark. This one made at April 1944 by 正永 Masanaga(hope no typo this time).

 

[ROKUJURO]

16 minutes ago, BANGBANGSAN said:

.....This one made in April 1944 by 正永 Masanage MASANAGA (hope no typo this time).....

Trystan,

to be sure you could re-read your text. On the other side, we know what you mean, so it's no big deal!