Help needed to determine Hada for a school or period.

[shan]

Hi all,

Been a while but hopefully someone will offer some help.

 

I have this Blade that has some anomalies and I would like some opinions based on what i can show in images and describe to you.

Blade is now of 50cm Nagasa Wakizashi length with Low mune and normal shinogi and opinions are that the hada is an older style Ayasugi of possibly Koto Gassan style.

I have someone who thinks it is late Gassan school or associated and is Ubu Nakago wakizashi form of the shinshinto period.

Would anyone else agree with this opinion?

The nakago does appear to be relatively recent (last 150 years or so at a guess) but the Hamon runs almost straight into the Nakago.

Would this indicate Machiokuri? If so then if there is only one Mekugi ana, then is it safe to assume O suriage due to the nakago being so "clean"?

I am sorry if the images are not too good, I have larger ones I can email.

The general consensus is Koto,O suriage,Ayasugi,Midare based on suguba with Uchinoke,inazuma, etc.

I am not sure the blade is meant to have a Yokote either as although it is in fair polish none is evident.

 

Please feel free with your findings as I am not sure of what direction to take with this blade and need your help with a decision on polishing it.

 

Thanks in anticipation

Shan

 

 

 

 

[Mark Green]

Shan,

My guess is that the Nakago was once cleaned, and re-patined, kinda?

What makes you think it is o-suriage? I'm not sure that it is any suriage. It looks classic Kanbun to me.

I feel that the thicker rust globs on the nakago is original rust that did not come off in the cleaning. I have seen this before.

The hada is great looking. Could be Gassan school. Not sure about Koto though.

mho, from the pics.

Do you have a pic of the very end of the nakago looking down the blade?

That may help. And, I'm pretty sure this is ment to have a Yokote

It looks to me that the last polisher may have needed to go just a bit deeper into the steel, to make it right. I feel it could be very nice.

Mark G

[Jacques]

Hi,

 

It looks classic Kanbun to me.

 

There are no Gassan smiths since late Koto (Tensho) until Shinshinto (Bunsei).

 

The hada is great looking. Could be Gassan school.

 

The hada discussed is not ayasugi and i don't think this blade is a Gassan one.

[shan]

Hi Mark,

Thanks for the reply.

some interesting points raised in there.

 

Shan,

What makes you think it is o-suriage?

Mark G

 

Well this was part of the question.

If a hamon runs into the nakago without stopping off at the Ha machi in classic Yakidashi or yakiotoshi then would this indicate either Machiokuri or suriage or did some blades hamon finish well into the nakago?

If there has been machiokuri then where is the second(first) mekugi ana?

 

Hi Jacques,

thankyou for the responce.

http://www.nihontocraft.com/Ura_Nihon_no_Toko.html.

item number 2 could be the oshigata of my blade ,boshi included and bar nakago of course.

this is what made me ask the question.

Not quite as exagerated but still undulating.

If Not then what hada is it?

i just don`t know.

[Jean]

If there has been machiokuri then where is the second(first) mekugi ana?

 

machi okuri does not automatically imply a second mekuhi ana

[shan]

Hi Jean,

I understand this is true if it is only moved a very little ,but would this statement be accurate on the Nakago in question?

Whats the definitive "giveaway" that the nakago is not untouched at the Machi? Yakidashi?

I understand that if a blade was yakidashi then any movement would be detectable to a degree.

If Yakiotoshi then a lot could be "taken back" before the blade appeared machiokuri.

Is this correct?

 

Many thanks

shan