Japanese swords in Indonesia.

[saemonjonosuke]

Maybe interesting to share. 

Dutch marines in Indonesia, Februari 13, 1948 East-Java.

The Javanese man with JP sword is a officier of the TNI.

(Source Twitter)

[PNSSHOGUN]

Great pictures, the sword appears to be a Type 95 NCO.

[Bruce Pennington]

Seems to have replaced the tsuba with one locally made?

[saemonjonosuke]

Better pictures of the source, NIMH. Dutch military site.

[Stegel]

Great Stuff!

Thanks for posting Johnny.

At first glance, the sword that 'Wesley Snipes' dad  has does look like a type95, but i'm not too sure on the tsuba just yet.

(i had no idea that Wesley was Indonesian!!)

 

I did a search on 'Sardjono Colorisation' and found lots of other photos from the period.

Here's one titled "A captured Indonesian company commander stripped of his sword. Plumbungan, Sidoarjo, East Java, Indonesia. August 1946."

Originally a Black and White photo, colourised by the same fellow.

(Not sure the ito wrap is the correct colour-  one of the problems we have with re-touched photo's i guess)

This one looks a bit like a civilian sword(not gunto), but would most likely be a local made item for the local forces under the Japanese Rule.

I'd be interested to see what other opinions we have here, any thoughts?

 

 

[saemonjonosuke]

This is the original photo.

[PNSSHOGUN]

It appears to be an original Japanese Koshirae repurposed for war.

[Brian]

Makeshift sarute?

[Stephen]

I dont see NCO in first photo.. blackened fittings with the leather strap instead of push button latch. String wrap ito. 

But we all know I'm blind. 😐

[vajo]

Hard to say. Could be a Type98 too.

 

The picture is handcolored. So the colors are what the "artist" think what the color should be.

[Bruce Pennington]

Boy, if that captured Java sword had showed up here, the first yell would be "FAKE"! Ha! 

Interesting menugi:

 

And that tsuba looks like a funnel! 

 

As to the first sword at top, the kabutogane of the 95s are almost identical in shape.  They lack the blossom/leaf pattern on top and sides like the officer one have.  But I looked at mine and the one on top is almost worn flat.  The ones on the side are actually riveted on (a peg on the backside of the leaf pattern that goes through the kabutogane) so, it could be missing from the one in the photo.  On top if it all, the photo detail is too blurry when zoomed to see such detail, so really hard to say.  If you consider the whole thing was likely Java-made, the fine details I'm talking about probably weren't there at all and it's likely their attempt at an officer gunto.

[Stephen]

Well y'all are the military experts, so what do i know.

[Bruce Pennington]

10 minutes ago, Stephen said:

Well y'all are the military experts, so what do i know.

Well, after another look, Stephen, I think you're right.  I can see a faint pattern on the tsuba, and what I thought was the fuchi sunken into a large hole (funnel), is really the center of the tsuba, with the fuchi above it. 

[Shamsy]

Bit hard to tell, but I'm with Stephen and Chris. I think it looks like a Type 98.

[Kiipu]

On 1/28/2022 at 6:21 PM, Stegel said:

This one looks a bit like a civilian sword (not gunto), but would most likely be a local made item for the local forces under the Japanese Rule.

 

I know of several swords of this style that came from the Netherlands East-Indies that are in Australian, Indonesian, and Dutch collections.  It must have been a popular style to imitate during the war years.  There are plenty of accounts of Indonesians carrying Japanese style swords after the war.  These young officers were trained by the Japanese Army and the sword carried the same meaning to them.  It was a badge of rank and authority.  Below is a link to just one of the swords I have recorded.  This one is coming via Indonesia.

My Katana Sword From Pembela Tanah Air/PETA army veteran WW2 in details

[Dave R]

A lot of conversation about these swords on here, some will be genuine Gunto and some the local made pseudo Gunto. Good luck telling which is which in blurry vintage photo's.

[Stegel]

@Dave R I agree with your summation, however, considering how many photo's you come across from the (Japanese) occupied territories, i think these are some of the best photo's we've come across. They provide quite a lot of detail compared to other photo's i've seen, so in that respect i can't agree with you.

 

If we consider the OP post of the supposed type 95, the tsuba as i said previously doesn't look right for a type 95, but it also doesn't look quite correct even for a type 98, which i would lean to, going by the kabutogane  (which i think is the correct word for the pommel)

The leather tassel is not the standard tassel for a type 95, but i have only seen these before on type 95's and never on type 98's. So the plot thickens and the mystery continues.

 

The second sword which i posted, and to which Johnny added the clearer originals, i think, is  as PNSSHOGUN (John) added, "appears to be an original Japanese Koshirae repurposed for war", just going by the menuki and overall appearance.(see Bruce's close up)

BTW it is clear in Johnny's photo that the colourised print i initially posted, is incorrect,  as the sarute would not be purplish, and the top part is in fact part of the Ito wrap, also not purplish.