Early Tanto

[Utopianarian]

Early koto tanto. 29cm nagasa. Utsuri with sparkling nie in hada and hamon that actually shows spectrum of multiple colors when in the right lighting hard to capture on camera. Engravings of sunken and Bonji have worn down thru many polishes. Appears like goma hashi and Koshi-bi and soe-hi. Hoping mid kamakura. Has a lot of traits like Rai school and awataguchi. Strong fumbari. Mumei. Will add more photos

Edited December 14, 2021 by Utopianarian
Additional info

[Utopianarian]

More photos

[sabiji]

Because of the unfortunately poor pictures can not say much.  The only thing that remains is the shape.

As for fumbari, this is rather rarely pronounced in tanto. To judge fumbari, you should rather look at the mune in the ha-machi area (munefumbari). Munefumbari remains much longer than the fumbari in the cutting edge area through various repairs and polishes. The "fumbari" in your tanto is simply the result of considerable material loss through various polishes. However, such worn forms and polished horimono were copied in the late Shinshinto quite deliberately.

 

If the shape is changed by various polishes, the assessment is even more difficult. Mid-Kamakura is very often Josun, so around 25 cm. But there are also longer or shorter blades. In most cases, however, they show a discreet uchizori in the area of the tip. Caution, this can also be caused by kissaki repair, so pay attention to the boshi.
Normally, Kamakura tanto have a very elegant shape due to discreet uchizori, a rather flat fukura and a discreet but even tapering. This tapering should also be considered with the Kasane. Later blades tend to be uniformly wide, uniformly strong in the kasane, and then quickly taper towards the kissaki, which is why the fukura appears rounder.
Anyway, I can't see classic Kamakura at first glance. At best, late Nanbokucho/early Muromachi. But I can be wrong.

 

[Utopianarian]

More pics. Appears takenoko-zori but very slight

[paulb]

George,

As Thomas has suggested what you are seeing is not fumbari but the result of the blade being reshaped when polished to remove a chip or fault near the hamachi. It look's to have lost a lot of metal which certainly could be an indicator of age. Can you let us have some dimensions? in the image it looks long and thin which would suggest a little later than Kamakura (at least to me) and more in to Nambokucho.

The images and condition don't allow too much conjecture regarding origin. 

[Utopianarian]

Pic

[Utopianarian]

Nagasa 29cm motohaba 2.6cm nakago nagasa 9.5cm

[Utopianarian]

Thank you Paul and Thomas. I will keep trying to get the best conditions and lighting over the next few days to get the best picture of the incredible nie and utsuri reflection and post the best of the pics. They look identical to the early kamakura blades that you often see online of awataguchi and rai school. It’s just so hard to get an accurate pic of that. Yes the blade is longer than most <10 inches in that time period but I know it’s generally the rule and there are other examples a little larger and smaller. 

[Utopianarian]

Motokasane 7mm let me know what other info you guys need regarding measurement etc.. forgot to add it has iori mune. I know most of the earlier tanto have mistu-mune but some do have iori-mune

Edited December 15, 2021 by Utopianarian
Additional info

[DKR]

Not Kamakura .......middle to late Muromachi period......just my two Cent.

[Utopianarian]

An odd note it appears like there is another utsuri along the mune on the blade as well as the traditional utsuri with a dark antai area between the two. 

[Utopianarian]

More pics

[Utopianarian]

[Utopianarian]

[Utopianarian]

[Geraint]

Dear George.

 

Do you not think the blade is machi okuri?   If so then the nagasa would have been around 30cms originally which changes things.  Of course it will have lost a little length from the kissaki through polishes so what it would have originally looked like would be a straight, rather wide and thick blade. 

 

Enjoy the puzzle!

 

All the best.

[lonely panet]

maybe a sue yamashiro ??

[Utopianarian]

The blade would have been a bit wider at the hamachi due to wear and polishes over the years but based on what I can see there is still a lot of boshi left and the hamon does not extend into the nakago and runs out right at the hamachi. So I am guessing the nagasa wasn’t very much longer. Also comparing with known existing examples that also would have seen much wear in varying degrees as well. I agree it does appear like Yamashiro work with what appears like nashiji hada. Does anybody confirm that this blade has this type of hada based on the last set of better pictures more focused on hada. 

[paulb]

AT the risk of boring readers (I have posted these images before) attached 2 pictures of Nashiji hada which I hope might help you to identify what you are looking at.

Basically nashi hada is extremely fine ko-itame hada covered with a profuse amount of ji-nie. If this a Yamashiro work you should also look for the hamon being predominantly ko-nie on an bright nioiguchi. There should be a lot of very bright activity such as inazuma and kinsuji running through the hamon.

 

[Utopianarian]

Thank you Paul I actually used this exact picture from a previous post to compare which to me appears as such. I can see sparkling ko-nie in the hamon and a bright nioiguchi (the line is set extremely close to the ha). I cannot make out inazuma or kinsuji. The nioiguchi looks like it is way below the hamon. The line is only 1-1.5 mm from the edge of the ha. The top of the hamon is subdued and has no line at the top like I see in most hamon.

[Utopianarian]

Maybe hadori polish was created by polisher to create more of a hamon since the nioiguchi is so close to ha which only leaves a thin hamon of only 1-1.5 mm from the ha. That’s my guess by reading some of Marcus sesko kantei 3.1 talking about nie and nioi and hadori can hide or add features. If taking into account that hadori polish was done to make hamon look wider due to excessive wear on the blade edge or ha, then the original hamon was hoso saguha by looking now at the thin existing nioiguchi line. The line however  does not run off the blade but extremely close to the ha. The line has much reflective sparkling nie.

[Utopianarian]

Here is an example of Kunimitsu. It shows the Nioiguchi line below the hamon along the ha.

[sabiji]

George,
your photos show at least Ko-Hada as well as Ji-Nie and together with your description of the Hamon it points to Yamashiro-Den - no matter from which time the Tanto actually originates.
The actual Nioguchi of the Hamon is not recognizable in your photos, nor the shape and position of the Boshi, length of the Kaeri, all important Kantei characteristics. Therefore, opinions here are simply speculations.  But maybe you look at the Ryokai school, which can look very similar to old Rai blades, often only with much less Hataraki. This would also fit into the time, which I have written before. But I wouldn't rule out Mihara either....
It would be ideal if you could personally show the blade to other experienced people around you.

 

[Utopianarian]

Thank you Thomas, I think you are absolutely correct in your assessment. I will continue to try to research the blade more. The hamon and boshi are hard to discern and are subdued which makes it challenging and leads to much speculation 

[Surfson]

Is there uchizori?

 

[Rivkin]

Mid Muromachi tanto. Regarding the school, it would difficult to be precise. For example, Ryokai. Nobukuni. Bungo. etc. etc.

[Utopianarian]

Yes has uchizori. Btw additional note: I had habaki verified because I thought it looked solid gold. The scratches had gold all the way thru and inside habaki was gold with no copper showing thru. I did a water displacement test to verify density- jeweler verified it for me. At least someone thought it was worth the expense to fit it with a decent habaki. Seems like the consensus for many here is it’s a muromachi or late made blade. At least the habaki is worth more than the blade I would guess

[Rivkin]

Kasane measurement could be helpful in cases like this one. Its one of those cases where sugata has the most likely interpretation, but there are less likely but legitimate possibilities, I guess.

[Utopianarian]

The nakago is very deteriorated. Does this appear to be Rai. I am creative and hopeful in my thinking which often gets me in trouble. Please give me your honest opinion if you see something potentially there or if it’s more of a Rorschach type of perception.

[Utopianarian]