Most resilient Gunto type?

[Kolekt-To]

Knowing what is known about the construction of guntos, of the various gunto types fielded during the war, what type would be most reliable and/or perform best in the field? Would it be the Type 95? Would it be the RS (AKA, Type 3)? How would a Type 98 or Type 97 perform? And, for what types of tasks - cutting foliage, cutting barbed wire, use in combat (such as banzai charge), etc.? 

[PNSSHOGUN]

Most likely it would be the Koa Isshin Mantetsu as they were scientifically designed to match this requirement. Use in combat is somewhat contentious, unfortunately it is more likely the majority of 'combat' use was far more macabre. 

[Bruce Pennington]

My vote would echo John - Koa Issin blade in RS mounts.  The lacquered ito version.  Gunto seen today with damage is almost always the ito.

 

For a Bansai charge, I would use the lightest gunto available, so probably a Type 95.  It's only good for waving around before you die, so why worry about the blade type?

[Kolekt-To]

Could someone please post a photo of a nice example of a Mantetsu blade in RS mounts, or post a link? 

[Bruce Pennington]

Well the most resilliant form of RS are the ones discussed on @IJASWORDS thread Manchurain Rinji Seishiki Sword.  There's almost nothing there to damage except the ito, and I'd have that lacquered. (his examples are not).

[Kolekt-To]

  On 9/17/2021 at 4:21 AM, Bruce Pennington said:

Well the most resilliant form of RS are the ones discussed on @IJASWORDS thread Manchurain Rinji Seishiki Sword.  There's almost nothing there to damage except the ito, and I'd have that lacquered. (his examples are not).

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Thanks for the link Bruce! 

[Corry]

Anything made of stainless would be out of the question. I would vote type 95. More functional and robust and the Tsuka won't fall apart in humid conditions.. I think for the most part, officers that were actively in combat left the swords at home.

 

 

 

Rgds,

Corry

[PNSSHOGUN]

  On 9/21/2021 at 12:29 PM, Corry said:

Anything made of stainless would be out of the question. I would vote type 95. More functional and robust and the Tsuka won't fall apart in humid conditions.. I think for the most part, officers that were actively in combat left the swords at home.

 

 

 

Rgds,

Corry

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That would be like an allied officer leaving his Thompson or M1 at home.

[Kolekt-To]

Type 97's were carried by officers of the Special Naval Landing Forces and these forces were involved in plenty of combat. Therefore, Kai Guntos were combat-tested in many land actions, as well.

[Corry]

  On 9/22/2021 at 12:46 AM, Kolekt-To said:

Type 97's were carried by officers of the Special Naval Landing Forces and these forces were involved in plenty of combat. Therefore, Kai Guntos were combat-tested in many land actions, as well.

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Stainles steel is too brittle to make a good combad sword. There needs to be a bit of flexion. Sure it can mess someone up. But no serious combat sword is made of it: "Stainless steel swords (or any blade over 12" long) is considered to be TOO brittle for serious usage and can shatter relatively easily (as demonstrated by the infamous 'home shopping video' below)."

 

https://www.sword-buyers-guide.com/sword-steels.html

 

[Kolekt-To]

Good point Durrell! However, not all Type 97's were made of stainless steel. In fact, most of my Kai Guntos (mostly arsenal blades) do not pass the magnet test - they are not stainless steel. I've heard that many Kai Guntos were not composed of stainless steel, so perhaps those would hold up better when actually used in combat.

[PNSSHOGUN]

Tempered stainless type steel used for Japanese wartime swords was somewhat different than the 420/440c stainless used for knives or chinese replica crap. The IJN wasn't compiled of idiots that commissioned swords for their officers that would shatter from a strong breeze.

 

For your interest: http://ohmura-study.net/212.html

[Corry]

  On 9/22/2021 at 1:27 AM, PNSSHOGUN said:

Tempered stainless type steel used for Japanese wartime swords was somewhat different than the 420/440c stainless used for knives or chinese replica crap. The IJN wasn't compiled of idiots that commissioned swords for their officers that would shatter from a strong breeze.

 

For your interest: http://ohmura-study.net/212.html

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It's less than an ideal metal to use. Perhaps for navy reasons/salt air the was best for them, but overall for combat, not the best material to use.

[PNSSHOGUN]

Definitely, it was a compromise (like many military armaments) between practical effective use and maintenance.

[Bruce Pennington]

We're off in LaLa Land in speculation, but I'll join.  The initial Western styled blades like the Type 19, 25, and 32 weren't "ideal for combat" either, as they quickly found out in the China invasion in the 1920s, but they were using them.  It's all they had and it was Army issue.  They HAD to use it.  As WWII progressed, they were experimenting with various production methods and steels in an attempt to meet a demand they couldn't keep up with.  Innovation was active and alive.  If all that was available to a new Naval officer, on new-guy pay, was a "anti-rust" bladed gunto, I can assure you he was not going to go to war without a gunto.