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Tassels for Rinji Seishiki?

Kolekt-To

By Kolekt-To
in Military Swords of Japan

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Kolekt-To Proficient

Kolekt-To

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I haven't seen many photos of Rinji Seishiki guntos with tassels. I do remember reading that, officially, they should not have sarutes attached. From my understanding, if tassels were employed, they would be the standard Army type (e.g., Brown/Blue for company-grade officers), and I assume they would be correctly threaded through the hole in the kabutogane, since they would lack a tassel loop or sarute. Is there any evidence of officers attaching a plain steel loop, or actual patterned sarute, for hanging the tassel? I have attached a photo below that appeared in a thread on this board showing two guntos in RS mounts where one has a tassel attached. Were tassels common on the Rinjis? Were they always threaded through the hole in the kabutogane without utilizing a sarute or steel ring, in accordance with regulations?

Rinji Seishiki_two guntos_one with tassel.jpg

Kolekt-To Proficient

Kolekt-To

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6 hours ago, Stephen said:

always be type 3 to me...lol

Type 3 is definitely a better reference term than "Special Naval Landing Forces" which, as we are aware, is the wrong term for this type of Army Gunto.

george trotter Grand Master

george trotter

Posted
Posted

 

I have 5 Rinji mounted swords ranging in quality from the steel scabbard type through high quality lacquer mounts up to one-off private mounting....NONE had/have a tassel. All those (maybe 12) I have seen in hand also had no tassels.

Maybe we can have some feedback from members on this...did your Rinji  (or should I say 'Alternative') swords have a tassel when you found them, or did you put them on? I'm not saying that they never had tassels, but just that I have never seen an original still in place.

Regards,

  • Like 3
Bruce Pennington Grand Master

Bruce Pennington

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Stephen said:

saying RS

The problem is that there is no name at all for this variant.  In his article Unveiling Rinjiseishiki Sword in 1940 (a very good read, BTW), Nick states:

"This word, "Rinjiseishiki", was a social buzz word in 1938, as even the new coinage issued to conserve war-critical metals were called Rinjiseishiki Coins, reflecting an overall shortage of raw materials caused by the China Incident of July 1937."  and after explaining the Uniform Regulation "loop hole" that allowed the creation of the variant, he says "If "Rinjiseishiki" is too much of a mouthful, now we can call it a "Type 98 Wartime Variant Version", as it was approved by the emperor as a package with the Type 98."

 

Much of our lingo is for ease of communication, so I like "RS" as well.  Much less typing!

  • Like 4
Bruce Pennington Grand Master

Bruce Pennington

Posted
Posted

Geoff,

I knew I had seen a drawing of the original RS.  Nick Komiya re-posted for me.  It shows the tassel tied through the hole in the kabutogane.  Now, we know that Officers (and enlisted) personalized their stuff often, and it would not surprise me to find that several had sarute added to their gunto.

Nick's post:  https://www.warrelics.eu/forum/f216/unveiling-rinjiseishiki-sword-1940-a-793016-post2194291/#post2194291

 

Rinji Mil Specs.jpg

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Kolekt-To Proficient

Kolekt-To

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Thanks for this information Bruce! Can we conclude that, during the war, most RS's did not have tassels attached and, that for those RS's that had tassels attached, there was a mix between some tassels being threaded through the hole in the kabutogane and others where a plain metal sarute (this would be the most common type of RS sarute) was attached with a tassel attached to it? Does this sound like a reasonable conclusion? I just wish we had more war time photos as evidence of these practices or lack thereof.

Kolekt-To Proficient

Kolekt-To

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I see your point Bruce - Army regulations requiring tassels. I agree with your assumption. But why do we have so many photos available of Type 98's, Kai Guntos, and Type 95's sporting tassels, and yet there's this lack of photos for the RS with tassels? :-?

robinalexander Grand Master

robinalexander

Posted
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Geoff,

To consider your question. It would be good to know (ballpark) , how many 95's and 98's were actually issued compared to RS swords.  Logically, if the RS are in a real minority (numbers wise) AND they were around more-so later war (i.e. more struggle than glory) then, again logically, there may be a lot less photos.  Just a thought. 

Rob

 

 

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Kolekt-To Proficient

Kolekt-To

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Good point Rob! Makes sense that there were less of this type produced compared to other types. As a new collector, I see so many of the RS type for sale on the current market that it gave me the impression that these were as common during the war as other types of gunto, at least during the final couple of years of the war. But, thinking about it now, and to your point, it makes sense that there would be less of these as they were really only seen in any significant numbers during 1944 and 1945. I would still like to see an estimate of the number of RS types produced vs other types, and I would still like to see some period photos of RS's with tassels attached. I may have to settle on realistic assumptions based on what has been discussed on this thread.

celt72 Collaborator

celt72

Posted
Posted

With the shortage of materials during 1944-45, I would be curious to know if there was a shortage of tassels produced also. This might also have an impact of the lack of tassels seen of the RS types. 

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robinalexander Grand Master

robinalexander

Posted
Posted

And another one just noticed on Ebay

 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/WW2-Japanese-SWORD-TYPE-3-OFFICERS-GUNTO-Signed-Nobumitsu-dated-Showa-18-/144188802868?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0

 

Looks made up to me but who knows, a lot of Type 95 sarutes are pretty shakey..... and with incorrect all brown tassel (unless Gunzoku).

Rob

 

Screenshot_2021-09-12-22-19-40.png

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Kolekt-To Proficient

Kolekt-To

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Posted

I decided to add a tassel to one of my RS guntos. And, I found an interesting photo on the Ohmura site showing a pilot with an RS and a Type 98 next to him, and the RS has a tassel attached. Furthermore, from our discussions here, and the photographic evidence provided (thanks guys!), we can confidently conclude that tassels were attached to RS guntos with or without sarutes.

RS Zuiho with tassel.jpg

RS and Type 98 with Pilot_Ohmura site.jpg

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