Hi all its ammad again . I bought a new sword . Plz let me knw if ita real or fake .

[Stephen]

ammad 

Your location says Pakistan surely you're not finding these gunto there are you?

If over 26 inches you can figure value closer to $5K in the right market. I'd say that for ins value

[vajo]

Interesting topic indeed.

 

Did you buy this in pakistan? 

 

It like indiana jones.

[Ammad]

Hey stephen how r u . Yup ur right we cant find these kind of sword 🗡 here . We can get the British collection but the Japanese are really hard to find . 

[Ammad]

Yes vajo i did . . Thank you always the first to reply i am much obliged. And every one ☝️ Has good knowledge about these rare swords . I would say you ppl are legends . I hope i can see all your collections as well here . . 

[Stephen]

For my record. How long is the blade tip to habaki. If you dont understand any words please ask.

So if you cant find there where did this come along?

Edited July 3, 2021 by Stephen

[Ammad]

Stephen I understand everything. . I am sending the measurements.give me few minutes  . Got stuck with some work . . . 

[Ammad]

By the way u look like john Cramer from the movie . Saw 

[vajo]

4 minutes ago, Ammad said:

By the way u look like john Cramer from the movie . Saw 

 

Stephen is one of the coolest guys here on the block 

[Ammad]

Yes he is . Vajo . . Stephen the length of the blade is an exact 26 inch. .and the sword came from my uncle who served in the army who is deceased  . I bought it from his son . ✌️. He is not much of a fan of swords . I guess i got lucky. 

[Stephen]

Yes you did with the sword ...but you're luck will run out if you think i look like this. Lmao

[Ammad]

Haahaha .. respect ✊🏻 stephen. . Like vajo said . U r a cool 😎 guy . . Thank you 🙏. For all your help . . 

[ChrisW]

This is another reason why the NMB is just simply the best. Friendly, knowledgeable folk who are willing to lend a hand! And agreed, Stephen is one of the coolest guys on here.

[Bruce Pennington]

On 7/2/2021 at 12:12 PM, Ammad said:

gunto type 98 with the missing hilt

I'd still get nervous if he got within 3 ft of a chainsaw!!! HA! Sorry Stephen, just had to get in on that one!

[Stephen]

I missed that one Bruce

[Bruce Pennington]

22 minutes ago, Stephen said:

missed that one

Sorry, mixed movies there.  Ammad referenced "Saw" and I was hitting on "Chainsaw Massacre" and how dangerous an old Marine could be with a chainsaw in his hand!

[Stephen]

Yep right over my head.

[Ammad]

Hey bruce .will get back to you  on that hilt handle . Soon. . Very bruce me imagining stephen with a chainsaw . Give me creeps . Lol

[Winchester]

Ammad, thank you very much for sharing this interesting sword on here. It is awesome and I really appreciate learning more about it. Best to you and yours, wherever this message finds you.

[Jacques D.]

On 7/1/2021 at 6:54 AM, Bruce Pennington said:

Ah, just as we suscpected!  A nice Star-stamped blade from an RJT smith (meaning the blade was made traditionally and is gendaito) made in June 1943.  Someone else will help with the mei.

 

Maybe traditionally made or not. Star stamp just means the sword is made by a RJT.

[PNSSHOGUN]

4 hours ago, Jacques D. said:

 

Maybe traditionally made or not. Star stamp just means the sword is made by a RJT.

Unless there is new evidence to the contrary, blades seen with the RJT star stamp are invariably Gendaito.

[ChrisW]

This is what I've always heard too. Anyone seen a counterexample yet?

[Brian]

Stop this right now. Not going to allow this horse to be flogged yet again. Jacques is wrong. RJT swords are Gendaito. End of story. No further debate.

[vajo]

Ammad has owned a real true gendaito in nice conditions. Be proud of it Ammad and care of it for the next generations of sword lovers. Its a very good investment for the future. The worth rise from every year to year. 

[Jacques D.]

 

 

10 hours ago, PNSSHOGUN said:

Unless there is new evidence to the contrary, blades seen with the RJT star stamp are invariably Gendaito.

 

Please do not reverse the burden of proof. It must be proven that the sword is traditionally made. Nothing prevents a RJT from forging a blade with modern steel and keeping the tamahagane for a special order. The punch system was put in place because it was often difficult to see the difference between a traditionally made sword and one that was not. 

 

 

[Bruce Pennington]

1 hour ago, Jacques D. said:

Nothing prevents a RJT from forging a blade with modern steel and keeping the tamahagane for a special order

Jacques,

While it is always true that every blade must stand on it's own, your idea is just that- an idea, imagination, speculation.  Here are the facts:

1.  We have an IJA Regulation stating that all RJT blades will be made with tamahagane, and multi-folded.

2.  We have an IJA Regulation showing that the Star is an army material stamp indicating that the material used in the manufacture of the item was provided by the army (and from item 1, we know the material provided was tamahagane).

3.  We have first-hand account from Kuniie, who inspected RJT blades and put the star on them.

 

For your idea to be true, a smith would have had to risk violating Army regulations and losing his contract, imprisonment, etc.  It's just not likely, and the burden of proving your hypothesis is on you.

 

A similar reverse conversation could be had about Sho and Seki stamped blades.  We have evidence from the Seki website and Ohmura-san that blades being inspected by the Seki Cutlery Manufacturers association were all showato.  Yet, there are guys who claim their blades are gendaito, and there is even a famous case where one passed shinsa and was papered.  So, in this case, the evidence says that blades stamped with Sho or Seki are showato, but someone may prove their blade to be an exception if the can.  The burden of proof is on them.

[Jacques D.]

[Jacques D.]

[Jacques D.]

From modern Japanese swords and swordsmiths by Krapp brothers ans Yoshindo Yoshihara. 

[Bruce Pennington]

Yes, Jacques, I've read Leon's book too.  Maybe you haven't been following our discussion on Arsenal Mark on RJT Sword Fittings.  There you will see that I've been corresponding with Leon about our recent discoveries in RJT regulations.  You will also find his revelation that after polishing a star-stamped RJT blade, himself, he now believes it to be tamahagane.

 

I see by your number of posts, that you are not new to Japanese sword collecting.  Maybe you're new to WWII gunto collecting, though?  Because if you've been around long enough, you will have learned that ALL reference material - Ohmura, Fuller, Dawson, Kapp, etc - have dated material in them that recent discoveries have made obsolete.  Even swordsmith interviews must be viewed with a grain-of-salt as they were simply reporting information as they understood it from their understanding of events.

 

Leon is currently working on an updated version of his book, and I suspect that section will see a revision with new information.

[Brian]

Jacques, you are embarrassing yourself.
It's clear there is far more knowledge on wartimeswords outside of Japan than inside. It's only recently they even started to look at them as decent swords. And throwing out outdated books just makes you look like you are clutching at straws. Give it a rest for goodness' sake!