Rubbish?

[Droocoo]

Hi all,

 

On my quest to learn more, I have come across another eBay seller listing this "Type 98 Officer's sword".

 

The habaki appears to be stamped in what I would describe as a hopeless attempt at fabrication:

 

 

The blade appears "signed" although of horrible quality. The Saya looks okay to me although I am not sure about the Koshirae.

All in all, this one looks terrible to me. Am I barking up the right tree here?

 

Kind Regards,

 

Andrew

 

[Droocoo]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/WWII-Japanese-TYPE-98-ARMY-SHIN-GUNTO-SWORD/363101040235?hash=item548a822e6b:g:7goAAOSwmTddVI9-

 

That is the listing, sorry 

[PNSSHOGUN]

This is authentic, but in such a poor state I would not invest anything in it.

[Brian]

I'm not convinced this is real. If it is, it's junk.

[Droocoo]

  On 4/4/2021 at 11:42 AM, PNSSHOGUN said:

This is authentic, but in such a poor state I would not invest anything in it.

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Thank you both for your responses,

 

John what points to this being original? 

 

Kind Regards,

 

Andrew

[PNSSHOGUN]

The fittings look original at the very least, blade is probably a fake that was stuck in to beat up original mounts. The more you look at good examples the easier it is to spot the fakes and junkers.

[Droocoo]

John,

 

I agree that the saya and koshirae look original, so we are on the same page there at least!

 

Andrew

[Bruce Pennington]

This is another example of what we have been struggling with, swords that are so poor we don’t think they’re original Japanese, but so good they don’t look like island swords. Like the one I just posted which had a clearly Japanese sword Smith signature, but a large number on the habaki.  A theory is developing that these were made in China for the Japanese.

[vajo]

for what they should put a no. on the habaki? I see this stamped habaki only on junk swords, mostly faked.

[Droocoo]

My question is then:

 

1. What is the purpose of stamping the habaki if that number does not appear on the saya or anywhere else?

2. Surely Chinese swordsmiths did not sign their blades. If this is a Japanese swordsmith, can we identify who it is?

 

The font on this habaki does not match any of the others in that other thread. This appears to be an 'Arial' typeset looking a lot more modern and uniform than the others. The patina of the stamped numbers appears the same as the surrounding habaki, so I assume that they are contemporaneous to eachother.

 

Andrew 

[lonely panet]

dont be fooled, 

 

this is just complete rubbish, nothing points toward being correct. its a crappy, made last week repro. the bull** sales pitch is a give away too

 

if you want to compare

Show Us Your High Class Gunto - Page 7 - Military Swords of Japan - Nihonto Message Board (militaria.co.za)

 

 

[Droocoo]

Stunning blades on that thread

 

Andrew

[Soshin]

Not much of a Japanese military sword collector, but as a dealer I get a lot offers from people wanting me to purchase remarkably similar modern fakes. They are likely made in mainland China as copies of low-quality World War 2 swords mostly made for noncommissioned officers. The signature on these swords is always poorly written and does not make sense from a Japanese language perspective.     

[Ian B3HR2UH]

Nothing points to this being original it is a reproduction . Rubbish as the title says

Ian Brooks

[Dave R]

Well.... for some reason most of the photo's have disappeared from the page there, but I would say that some bits are original, and the rest much less so.

 There is a thread about numbered Habaki on NMB that is worth reading, they are not all Chinese fakes though most probably are.

[Droocoo]

  On 4/5/2021 at 8:40 AM, Dave R said:

Well.... for some reason most of the photo's have disappeared from the page there, but I would say that some bits are original, and the rest much less so.

 There is a thread about numbered Habaki on NMB that is worth reading, they are not all Chinese fakes though most probably are.

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Thanks Dave,

 

Yes in the earlier comments a link to that thread was posted. The stamped numbers on that thread look a lot different to this font.

 

Andrew

[dwmc]

3:30 am...Surely this must be a nightmare...I going back to bed !!!  Horrible...

 

Dave M.