Kantei

[Jacques D.]

Can you put an era, a region, a school, a name on this dagger? 

 

I don't have any description just nagasa = 26.36 cm (8 sun 7bu), very slight sori

 

 

 

 

 

[Rivkin]

It looks like a classically shaped and styled Soshu tanto crossing into hitatsura, which makes it one of the most copied sugata and styles, and accordingly can be difficult to identify precisely.

Knowing kasane would be very useful here, but one can try without it.

If one assumes its an original from Nambokucho period, then it should not be Hasebe because of the nakago, it can't be Akihiro because he did not do kaeri half nagasa long. Generally such execution is seen on extremely rare occasions with Hiromitsu and thus Masahiro, but it did not gain popularity until well into Muromachi. Also is their case the hardening along the mune seldom exhibits such well defined and sharp togari, its also more of Muromachi feature. Still, sometimes on hitatsura blade the length and togari of this era are excaggerated by oshigata makers, what in real life looks like faint disconnected tobiyaki becomes a single contour with sharp edges. One can hope that's not the case here. Can be Nobukuni, but highly unlikely.

 

P.S. Just by chance I was going through some blades and remembered that hitatsura with very long kaeri and sharp togari close to mune in Nambokucho does occur with later Etchu students - Tametsugu, Hojoji Kunimutsu and Etchu Kuniyuki. Rather rare examples, would match the work here quite well. These are rare works, and unfortunately them being quite late in Nambokucho sugata can be tricky one to rely on. Out of these three Kuniyuki is most well known for this style, I guess. Kasane would tell more...

 

So in all likeness this is late Muromachi, someone who worked in Soshu style, which is also a somewhat more natural match for sugata. With different nakago I would bet on Muramasa, since the hamon is reasonably symmetric and now and then he did work in such style. As is, we are talking about the period when even major Bizen smiths occasionally made hitatsura, and half of Mino guys were churning them up as well. Signature placing is not very Bizen-ish though. Can be Masahiro, Hiromasa, Tsunahiro, Fuyuhiro, Shimada or even Muramasa with a very unusual nakago. An upper quality example for any of these names. Occasionally one sees an almost exact later, Edo period, copy of such work, but nothing here clearly suggests this to be the case.

 

So unfortunately this is the case where I would even theoretically not aim above dozen. First choice - late muromachi, sue-Soshu. Second choice - late Nambokucho, some Etchu Soshu smith, most likely Etchu Kuniyuki. In hand or with photographs one could easily spot the difference - Etchu examples would have much stronger hada, with a hint of Matsukawa, with plenty of ji nie and strong black hue to it. Kasane would be thinner. Nie would have pronounced "belted" structure. Sue-Soshu would have generally coarser nie, coarser hada, less pronounced color.

[Jacques D.]

Just one to try to guess?  Yet, there is nothing to lose...

[BIG]

Late KOTO Bizen HITATSURA Tanto ( Sukesada )

 

BEST

[Alex A]

From whats available, Shimada (wavy kaeri)

[16k]

Makes me think a lot about that blade by Kaneyuki

[Fuuten]

That one is listed under reference right?

Something about the Sanmei website is super calming and peaceful to me. Love going through their reference list from time to time.

[Jacques D.]

First of all, thanks to those who answered and in particular to those who respected the rules of the kantei by giving only a name instead of a novel (which does not answer besides). 

However if you can't give a name, you can try a school, or a province or an era; that depends of your level of knowledge

 

The answer is Sukehiro (Fukuoka Ichimonji), the nagasa and the sori are in accordance with the epoch, late Kamakura. 
No. 6 on the list:

https://www.kusanaginoya.com/report/日刀保京都府支部１０月例会/

When I saw this oshigata and saw the identity of the blacksmith, I thought of the yamatorige  hamon being O-busa choji midare

 

https://Japan-forward.com/国宝「太刀-無銘一文字（山鳥毛）」（個人蔵）/

 

This blacksmith is an illustrious unknown who is just mentioned in the Nihontö meikan. 

As I expected, no good answer and none that are close, which proves that the kantei must be reserved to the known smiths and presenting their usual work, otherwise we learn nothing.  

[Alex A]

Exactly, unless the blade in question is "textbook", then for me Kantei is nonsense.

 

If you look hard enough you will find similar work that looks to be a good fit, but in the end its just a waste of time, especially from images only

[16k]

And this is why my belief in Kantei is somewhat quite light. Pretty sure many unknown mumei blades have given great atttributions because they looked like so and so. Many John Smith are probably around with papers to Hasebe or some famous other.

[Alex A]

Didn't spend long on it, usually i find if you bump a number of keywords into a google search then sometimes it can lead you on to the right path and funnily enough im pretty sure the correct smith got a mention somewhere along the lines.

 

So i suppose you could always fluke it.

 

I didnt think the blade was that old, reminded me of Mino and Soshu, hence my wrong answer.

 

If textbook and with good images and relevant info then its not rocket science, someone always gets it, especially those that have spent a bit of time getting to know the work of a particular smith/school for one reason or another.

 

 

 

 

 

[Rivkin]

There are not that many chances to mistake sue-Soshu with Fukuoka Ichimonji - unless one is dedicated enough to spend hours trying to find oshigata that looks alike and skips the rest of the description, like nie deki or nioi deki, utsuri etc.

In real life or on photographs jigane, hamon would be completely different. Ko Hoki or Rai Kuniyuki could give one trouble though.

[Jacques D.]

8 hours ago, Rivkin said:

unless one is dedicated enough to spend hours trying to find oshigata that looks alike and skips the rest of the description, like nie deki or nioi deki, utsuri etc.

In real life or on photographs jigane, hamon would be completely different. 

 

 

What's a kantei ? it's a memory exercise before all. To be useful it must be done without any help. When you have a sword in hands you don't have tons of oshigata near you to check. Once, a Japanese expert said to me "if you don't find in 3 or 4 minutes it's lost."

 

The kantei based on pictures are not kantei but divinatory exercises without interest. A kantei is done on a whole blade where you can see all the characteristics which is impossible with photographs.  

[Alex A]

22 minutes ago, Jacques D. said:

 

 

What's a kantei ? it's a memory exercise before all. To be useful it must be done without any help. When you have a sword in hands you don't have tons of oshigata near you to check. Once, a Japanese expert said to me "if you don't find in 3 or 4 minutes it's lost."

 

The kantei based on pictures are not kantei but divinatory exercises without interest. A kantei is done on a whole blade where you can see all the characteristics which is impossible with photographs.  

 

 

For most of us, its just a bit of fun, like doing a crossword or something. For me, wasting time filling my head with enough info to do it without books is overkill.

 

Also, if a shinsa team need a suitcase full of references then what hope have most of us got looking at images on a forum.

 

As mentioned, if described well with good images, someone always gets it.

 

For me personally, the fun of this hobby is the journey and learning as i go. 

 

Forums and an increase in knowledge can be difficult though, helping others often ruffles feathers can can lead to childish name calling etc, which ruins it for most folk.

 

Most here regurgitate what is written in books. Ford Hallams knowledge is immense, and then we have folk like Jussi that come across as not being stuck in 1860, compiling info etc.

 

So most of us, know *** all

[Jacques D.]

I would add that this tanto is interesting as it's probably the only one Fukuoka Ichimonji tanto extant.

[Hoshi]

Oh my. Let's not throw the baby with the bathwater. 

 

Remember that in Kantei the right answer is to nail down the archetype. Whatever obscure look-alike smith comes from under the rug is of little importance for scoring the Atari. 

 

Next. Agreed that for a beginner these types of kantei are not useful. One must master the basics firsts. That said, Kantei with obscure look-like smiths are not "useless" after a certain level of ability. Once you know all the classics, you need to become aware of the exceptions to the rule. Even if these are not distinguishable, you will build a deeper understanding of what an attribution to a certain smith or school could mean.

 

For example, great many smiths have been lost to history and their extent zaimei work are nill or very few. Hata Chogi, Soshu Kaneshige ...many early soshu disciples of Kamakura and beyond, and the list goes on. Fukuoka Ichimonji had a substantial amount of mastersmiths whose zai work are lost or extremely rare. Attributions to masters like Rai Kunimitsu, Shintogo or Nagamitsu can be product of their respective "corporations" or student work and vary wildly in quality (and price) - there are simply too many extant to be the creation of a single smith. All of these nuances require experience, and being confronted to atypical kantei can help in acquiring it. 

 

Finally the idea that internet kantei is pointless is no good. In this day and age there are beautiful videos being produced, or photos with description to fill in the gap. While these do not replace the real in hand experience, they do come close and will improve your knowledge. 

 

And these will keep getting better: