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I’m having a blade polished...

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16k Grand Master

16k

Posted
Posted

Okay, so this thread is sure to be polemical I’m afraid...

 

Brian, I have good reasons to post it (explained below) so please don’t delete it. If you think the discussion gets out of hand, lock it, but please don’t delete it.

 

So, first, let me give the reasons for this thread:

 

I don’t have that many swords but all of them are in very good to perfect polish. Except for one...

 

It was my first Nihonto (more about it here

 

So, after many years , I decided to have it polished. I’m not rich so the top polishers in Japan are out of my reach and besides, with C19, the world postal services have become too much of a hazard to send swords at the moment I think. I don’t count the books that have been lost by the post this past year. No way I was gonna take a risk with a sword.

 

So I decided I would have to be polished in Europe. I was advised Les Stewart. My Email to him was ready... and Brexit happened. I could have tried anyway but I said, "what the hell, let’s try to remain in the EU".

 

The number of polishers is limited in the EU. Someone in a thread, mentioned Pierluigi. I took a glance at his site and this video convinced me.

 

 

 

I know it is a gamble and that a lot of you will protest because he isn’t a Japanese trained togishi. Hell, some of you guys even won’t consider David Hoffhine whereas he is in my eyes, better than some Japanese polishers I’ve seen.

 

I'll let Pierluigi introduce himself and his training:

"As for my training in the polishing of swords, I started it all by myself, I had the opportunity, over the years of seeing many swords artistically polished, to go to Master yoshindo yoshiara's house for an interview where he taught me some basic passages for polishing and making tamahagane, and he showed me many of his blades.

I've been at the source of tokens, I've been able to appreciate blades that are not comparable with ours, even as talented blades.

I often get in touch with Japanese polishers, they often advise me. I have polished over 150

Blades between mine and ancient ones. That's my full CV!"

 

So consider this thread as an experiment with several purposes:

 

  • First, if you are interested in polishing, Pierluigi publishes the different stages of his work on Facebook and Instagram. For those of you who don’t have it, if this thread isn’t locked, I’ll post his progress as it comes. As I’m writing this, he’s using the Binsui stone. He has rectified a number of geometry issues, most notably the Kissaki which was wrong and not jutting anymore.
  • I think this can be an interested and pedagogical experiment to follow, almost live, the work of a polisher.
  • If Pierluigi does a good job (and I have no doubt he will- by the way his communication is great and he associates me with every decision he takes), then we Europeans will know we have a new togishi we can count on
  • Isn’t it great to help a talented guy make a name? :)

 

you can follow the progress here on Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/pierluigiponziokatanakaji/

 

... or here on Instagram:

https://www.instagram.com/katana_kaji_japanesesword/

 

For those of you that don’t do Facebook or Instagram, provided this thread isn’t locked, I’ll post the progress in the posts below.

 

 

So, here we go, enjoy the process and if Brian allows, comment. :)

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  • Like 3
Ed Harbulak Collaborator

Ed Harbulak

Posted
Posted

There had been a polisher in France, who's name I no longer remember, who wrote a book on Japanese sword polishing. I believe he was at least partially trained in Japan, but I don't know if he's still alive or working. I believe there's also a Japanese trained polisher in Slovakia who I believe contributed to some topics here on NMB. It would seem the polisher you sent your sword to has at least been in contact with polishers in Japan and the video seems to indicate he knows what he's doing. It will be interesting to see the final results with your blade, assuming Brian allows it. Ultimately, the finished blade will determine if Pierluigi is a qualified polisher, so time will tell. 

  • Like 1
16k Grand Master

16k

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Hi Ed,

 

Yes, and he was very talented, trained in Japan. His name was Laurent Milhau. Sadly he passed away prematurely a long time ago.

16k Grand Master

16k

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  • Author
Posted

Never heard of him. Thanks for mentioning another potential European polisher.

 

EDIT:

Found him on Facebook. I don’t know if he has polishing skills, but he certainly does a great job with armors!

PNSSHOGUN Grand Master

PNSSHOGUN

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Posted

Martin Hornak seems to be one of the best in Europe, he regularly travels to Japan. This Pierluigi guy does not look promising but I hope the end results are satisfactory.

French nihonto Collaborator

French nihonto

Posted
Posted

the problem with all this is that a European polisher, even the most talented, with 30 years of training with a Japanese master, will not be able to do an optimal job if he does not have access to the right stone. and have known that good stones are increasingly rare, and that even Japanese polishers are starting to have difficulty finding them. Talent without the material is useless

16k Grand Master

16k

Posted
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Posted
2 hours ago, Brian said:

Hmmmmm.
https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/29786-warning-with-these-scammers/
https://www.instagram.com/katana_kaji_japanesesword/?igshid=19mpylor2rebz
 

You decide


 

 

Uuuhm... of course, those threads are rather scary...

 

To his defense, on his own website, Pierluigi never pretends to be Japanese trained, nor does he mention anything than being self taught.

He makes swords but says he is a collector and doesn’t sell antiques, so maybe some less than honest people used his talents to scam others. I’ll ask him if he wants to respond to these stories and explain what happened.

44 minutes ago, David Flynn said:

Expertise d’antiquités japonaises à Écouen (patrice-sabbah-katana.com)

I know of Patrice Sabbah. My friend François has even visited him. The trouble is he doesn’t show much on his site so it’s hard to judge his skills.

kaliatur Apprentice

kaliatur

Posted
Posted

I heard about an Italian named Massimo Rossi . I talk with a french guy who send a sword to him (I can give you his name to contact him).

 

There is too a well knowned french smith (Michael Sabatier) who work with a very good slovakian polisher, maybe the same Ed talked about ?

 

Goog luck, it will not be easy...

  • Thanks 2
16k Grand Master

16k

Posted
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Posted

Hi Geoffroy, i know of Massimo. Never heard about Patrick Sabatier though.

 

As I said in my intro, I know I took a risk, both by using a guy I’d never heard of and by posting this thread. I did it purposefully. I’m a teacher by trade. I guess it is in my DNA to give talent a chance and I like to find new people and help them show their skills. In the end, I think the result will be the best judge. If it is bad, we’ll things will be settled. If it is good, then well have a new guy.

 

I must say that for the moment, my conversation with him and his serious take on the job, suggestions and daily updates have me pretty confident. Stay tuned as they say! :)

  • Like 2
PNSSHOGUN Grand Master

PNSSHOGUN

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18 minutes ago, kaliatur said:

I heard about an Italian named Massimo Rossi . I talk with a french guy who send a sword to him (I can give you his name to contact him).

 

There is too a well knowned french smith (Michael Sabatier) who work with a very good slovakian polisher, maybe the same Ed talked about ?

 

Goog luck, it will not be easy...

@martin hornakis the Togishi from Slovakia, I believe he posts here now and again.

  • Like 1
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kaliatur Apprentice

kaliatur

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, 16k said:

Hi Geoffroy, i know of Massimo. Never heard about Patrick Sabatier though.

 

As I said in my intro, I know I took a risk, both by using a guy I’d never heard of and by posting this thread. I did it purposefully. I’m a teacher by trade. I guess it is in my DNA to give talent a chance and I like to find new people and help them show their skills. In the end, I think the result will be the best judge. If it is bad, we’ll things will be settled. If it is good, then we’ll have a new guy.

 

I must say that for the moment, my conversation with him and his serious take on the job, suggestions and daily updates have me pretty confident. Stay tuned as they say! :)

 

Michael Sabatier not Patrick^^ it is a french smith (you could find him on internet or FB).

 

He work with Martin Hornak

  • Haha 1
francois2605 Experienced

francois2605

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, PNSSHOGUN said:

Martin Hornak seems to be one of the best in Europe, he regularly travels to Japan. This Pierluigi guy does not look promising but I hope the end results are satisfactory.

 

He's the one David Hofhine referred me to after explaining he was no longer accepting commissions from abroad.

  • Like 1
kaliatur Apprentice

kaliatur

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Posted

Very Harsh :( I personnally never work with them...As JP, we try to find good addresses of polishers in Europe.

 

How could you know about their (incompetent) work?

 

Do you have good addresses of europeans polishers ?

  • Like 2
JH Lee Community Regular

JH Lee

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, Brian said:

Hmmmmm.
https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/29786-warning-with-these-scammers/
https://www.instagram.com/katana_kaji_japanesesword/?igshid=19mpylor2rebz
 

You decide


 

 

 

This is terrible and deeply upsetting.  Are they making fake replicas and then intentionally passing them off as genuine antiques??  Or lying about polishing expertise they do not possess?  That's not only unethical, it's ILLEGAL.

 

As an extremely inexperienced collector myself, I have to say that this kind of crap makes me even more reluctant and weary.  Thankfully, my funds are limited anyway for any impulse buying, but still....

 

Anyway, if they are deliberately engaged in making fakes and lying to their customers, that is FRAUD by definition and they should be prosecuted by law as criminals!

  • Like 1
16k Grand Master

16k

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Posted

As far as I know, Pierluigi sold them some genuine antiques and THEY modified them. He ceased his business with them upon learning that.

Jacques D. Grand Master

Jacques D.

Posted
Posted

Geoffroy,

 

I personnaly know most of them and i've seen their job... 

 

To my knowledge, there are only 2 traditionnaly trained polishers in western Europe, Massimo Rossi and Zenon Vandamme but i know Zenon have health problems and i don't know if it still works.

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b.hennick Grand Master

b.hennick

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Posted

Even if the blade looks fine after the polish by a not fully trained polisher, my worry is that he will remove more steel than necessary. This will reduce the life of the sword.

I had a long delay with the polishing of a sword by a fully trained polisher. He told me that he needed the right stone and did not have it. He looked for the stone and I waited. The polish was amazing, the wait was worthwhile, I was much younger then!

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16k Grand Master

16k

Posted
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Posted

Yes,

 

I first heard about him when I knew nothing about swords. I was visiting Robert Buravoy’s gallery in Le Marais, Paris, and he showed me two swords he was selling. One was a Tadayoshi. The other, I don’t remember. He told me they were just back from polishing. Now, at the time, I had read about Hada but never seen a real sword. He showed me the Sword and it was just marvelous. I guess I was definitely hooked on that day. Then he told me that his polisher had just passed it would be difficult to find a new polisher as talented as him in France. I learned the name much later.

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Surfson Grand Master

Surfson

Posted
Posted

Have followed this thread with a cringe.  Jean-Pierre, is Robert Burawoy still in business?  I had a great visit with him decades ago and saw everything he had in his shop.  Very nice guy. 

16k Grand Master

16k

Posted
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Posted

I don’t think he is, Robert. His gallery doesn’t exist anymore at least.

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