Omori Teruhide...again

[Brian]

Hi all,

I was asked to post this one for the opinion of the forum. As always with this smith, gimei is assumed, but this one does seem to be better done than the usual copies, and I think it has a chance imho. Very nice work indeed. Mei does have some small differences in the kao to published Juyo examples and looking at the other Teruhide thread, but I do see differences in the shoshin examples too. So what sayeth the forum?

 

Brian

[Stephen]

Ill take the Ford road, send it to me for a year to give it a closer look, very nice work.

[docliss]

Dear Brian

 

This is a very impressive tsuba, in a very dark grey shibuichi that is almost shakudō-like in its appearance. The waves are very fluid, and many of them are undercut; the dots of gold spray are variable in their size. The mei demonstrates the angular form of the last two strokes of the ‘hide’ kanji, and corresponds with the kao, which was the last he used, ca 1796.

 

I hesitate to say a definite ‘yes’, but it looks pretty good to me.

 

John L.

[Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini]

Gimei or not, I wish it was mine.

[nagamaki - Franco]

Dear Brian

I hesitate to say a definite ‘yes’, but it looks pretty good to me.

 

John L.

 

ditto. Further, it would be interesting to have seen or at least know what sword this tsuba came off of noticing that the sword had bo-hi.

[Pete Klein]

The following scan is from the Kinko Meikan and the same mei examples are to be found in Wakayama plus a few extra. All point to this being gimei:

[nagamaki - Franco]

Brian, the point may be moot following Pete's post and after checking the mei with the one below, so much for quick responses , however, the pic posted looks a bit cartoonish, pardon my saying, making it tough to get a good 'impression' for the quality of the shakudo/shibuichi. Is there any chance of seeing an image which which looks more photographic?

 

Another valid mei for comparison.

[Brian]

Thanks for that Pete and others. I have added this mei to Pete's scan for better comparison. Agree it doesn't match the examples. With work as good as this, I wonder if it could be a student signing for the master, or someone else connected to Omori Teruhide?

I am not sure if the owner has others pics right now, but will confirm and post if and when they are available. Interesting observation that the tsuba was made to conform to the bo-hi on the blade.

 

Brian

[docliss]

Oh ye of little faith .... Could any kind member please scan in the photographs from Wakayama, Vol. 1? I should particularly like to compare this mei with those of the bottom right fuchi on pp. 34 and 35.

 

With thanks, John L.

[Pete Klein]

It's also signed on the opposite side.

[Brian]

Don't you remember that day Pete? He had been out sake tasting, and managed to hit his thumb while working with the chisels. Had to sign with the left hand for the rest of the day, and on the left side of the tsuba

Still wanna see those Wakayama pics...

 

Brian

[Martin]

Hi all,

 

could it be possible that the students of the school signed on the opposite side?

Just a thought...

 

Best,

[docliss]

We do not know the answer to the question that both Pete and Martin have raised, and I certainly do not personally believe that a mei on the left-hand side of the tenjo of a fuchi, or the seppa-dai of a tsuba, precludes them from being a genuine work by Omori Teruhide. In fact, one fuchi of the five artefacts illustrated on pp. 51-52 of Kinko Meikan has the mei on the left.

 

John L.

[drbvac]

Oh well, not a bad forgery Brian. I'll give ya 20 bucks for it and pay the shipping

[Brian]

Dr B.

I only wish it were mine. Posting it for someone else. Hoping to have more pics and info shortly.

 

Brian

[Ludolf Richter]

Hi Brian,here are some mei pics of Omori Teruhide.Look at the workmanship of the example below yours:very similar!I had it papered.Ludolf

[Brian]

Thanks for that Ludolf. Very interesting...that one is signed on the left of the seppa dai and you say it papered to Omori Teruhide?

I wish this set were mine instead of posting for someone else :lol:

 

Here is some more info from the owner. This isn't just a tsuba..it is a daisho of 2 x tsuba, 2 x fuchi and kashira sets, 1 x kozuka and 1 x kogai Menuki are gold crayfish and likely another good school.

These are the only pics I have for now. Some variances in the mei on the various fittings. Workmanship on all looks very good indeed. The owner sends his thanks for the comments and assistance so far.

 

Brian

[Stephen]

to a small time guy like me it wouldnt mean a hell of beans if gimei, thats one very nice set.

[Ludolf Richter]

Here comes a new pic with "your" and "my" Tsuba.I don't remember from which book I have it.When I was creating my private Tosogo-mei.database,now with around 5000 entries,I had copied only the part with the Mei as seen in my pic.As I had already remarked:very similar to "your" Tsuba.Ludolf

[DirkO]

Very nice set indeed !!! Brian, can you please ask for pics of the front of the kozuka as well as the daisho-swords ??? Curious to see whether the quality of the blades matches the tosogu

[Henry Wilson]

I don't know if this has been covered in other posts but to be honest Brian, I think it is a situation were the quality of the work will need to do the talking and be the main the indication for whether the signature is Gimei or not.

 

I personally think the signature is not real because the one that you have posted is a bit too tidy compared to the others posted by Ludolf. I think the third kanji 英 is a good example of this. I could have been done by a student or another contemporary.

[nagamaki - Franco]

Brian, thanks for additional pics, info. IMHO this set is not only gimei as Omori Teruhide, but more importantly it is very doubtful to even being Omori work. Good copies though. The following link is to a wave tsuba http://www.nihonto.com/galwave.html, that while recognizing it is unsigned, it is representative of actual 'Omori work'. While at first glance the similarities between pieces are certainly there, upon closer examination the differences are notable.

[Brian]

Franco,

I don't have a vested interest in this set, so my opinions aren't biased. But the one you linked to doesn't strike me as being all that well done? Good work, but not what I would expect from the limited exposure I have had to Omori work. The quality of the undercutting and varied size of the drops (mixed metals) on this set looks far better done? Just my opinion of course (and an amateur one at that) but I think there have been better examples posted.

I am of course not sure at all about the mei, but not so much about the quality. Compare the detail of the waves and lines in the water, and the inlay.

Here's from the MFA collection: (Also in Lethal Elegance?)

 

All very interesting discussion and a good resource for future discussions on the Omori school.

 

Brian

[docliss]

I am still hoping for a response to my earlier request for a kind member to post the images from Wakayama, vol. 1, pp. 34 and 35. In the meantime, I am attaching an image of a mei illustrated in Robert E. Haynes, Ltd Catalog #7, lot no 241, p. 189. This illustrates a ‘left-sided’ mei that is very similar to this one and comes from a tsuba that Haynes confidently lists as being the work of Omori Teruhide ‘in his very old age’.

 

In spite of the many opinions to the contrary, I still think that this tsuba has a very good chance of being papered to this artist.

 

John L.

[nagamaki - Franco]

Hi Brian, please don't misunderstand, I'm not addressing or making statements of better or not better. Thank you for bringing up the MFA example which is certainly a more direct comparison to the discussion tsuba, but this MFA example only reinforces my previous opinion.

 

For what it's worth many of the MFA Omori Teruhide tsuba are signed on the same side as the discussion tsuba.

[Pete Klein]

Wakayama 34 & 35.

 

[docliss]

Thank you Pete for those - I must confess to a tiny reduction in my previously confident stance! John L.

[Pete Klein]

Well, sorry not to be Suzy Sunshine on these but the whole set is 'married'; IOW's the mei are all different and none conform (to my eye at least) to those listed in the Meikan or Wakayama. As I've mentioned so many times before if in doubt get thee to the NBTHK shinsa quickly! (LOL)

 

Some observations: If you are using the old Meikan from the seventies you really should invest in the new one from the nineties. The older one has mei examples which have been deleted as they have been decided against being shoshin therefore using the older version may lead to inaccurate conclusions. Also, it is usually not the best idea to go by 'collection' books to judge the validity of mei no matter how prestigious (as in Boston or Bauer). I know, heresy, but those collections have gimei examples (they all do). The Haynes catalogs have mistakes also (excommunication assured) so one again should be careful before using them as the final argument toward validity. The field is ever evolving so it is important to keep up with current views (if this is of import to you -- it doesn't have to be if you collect solely for fabrication or artistry). The never ending saga.

 

PS: a note on 'Student Work". This is an argument primarily used by dealers to sell wares which they well know not to be shoshin. Basically all masters had students doing work on their creations but the mei is theirs, either by them or by someone designated to sign consistently for them. When the student graduates to the level of producing his own work he signs with his own mei. All else is speculation. We know that Sadakatsu produced swords for his father Sadakatzu yet the mei is still Sadakatzu, not Sadakatsu. It's just how the system worked. You aren't the master until you are.

[Brian]

Pete,

Couldn't agree more. All great advice and this is a good thread to future reference.

Whether gimei or not, I love this set, but not mine so I can only drool. Thanks for all the help on behalf of the lurker.

 

Regards,

Brian

[Stever]

Uhhh, just out of curiosity, did anyone else notice the striking similarity between Ludolf's tsuba and the one Brian posted from the MFA? They appear identical, does this suggest one is a copy of the other? Would Teruhide have produced multiples of the identical design?

 

cheers,

/steve

 

[edited to add file]